We pay $50-$55,000 for a new Corvette. I look at the Lexus and some of the foreign cars and I see the quality, the way the sections line up, the fit, paint- no orange peel, and I wonder if you guys ever really looked at the Chevy dashboard. Look how wavy they are. With the leather interiror, the stitching is farther apart than on the foreign cars, and the carpeting doesn't fit snug either. I feel, the quality of the plastics used on Amercian cars are inferior to that of foreign cars. Look at the plastic trim and the way it fits. And, on American cars look at the wiring harnesses, and how sometimes they are slopped around a bit, or the tape is coming off the plastic insulator for the wiring.
What if they didn't have the UAW and the wages were low. And, they didn't have the excuse "well the labor is high in America". Would they put a better product out? For less money? I don't think so. I don't blame it on the workers, that the workmanship isn't up to par. I blame it on the management. In Japan they try to improve, not cut corners, or use cheaper material. And, it shows, we are losing the race. I am a craftsman in my field and so was my dad, and many of my colleagues that I worked with through the years also agree, that the quality of the foreign cars and the types of material used, especially the weatherstripping, on GM products starts to crack and rip.
I have a Subaru with 236,000 miles on it and the weatherstripping around the window still feels and looks like it came out of the showroom. I think American companies lean more towards the profits than product quality. Or, are we all too complacent as consumers?
Take the Z06. You have to pay more money, and they say "well, you have a German transmission in there". Why aren't we able to boast "I have an American transmission in my Vette". This should tell you something. Just a thought. Feel free to comment or tell me off if I am wrong.
People like you just piss me off always bragging about import cars This is America you should by Americac,support America Quit whinning!!The Vette is the best car by far.....
Originally posted by Jim ODeen People like you just piss me off always bragging about import cars This is America you should by Americac,support America Quit whinning!!The Vette is the best car by far.....
Go have a beer and chill. I am talking about craftsmanship, not our country.
It's about improving on our products, so we can be prouder and compete globally. I don't like to see better craftsmanship in a foreign car. It disturbs me, because I love my country. But, unfortunatley there is truth to craftsmanship deterioraton in the US. Let's face it and change it. That's pride. Pride to do better and not live with the false security that everything is OK, when its not. Before you know it, we'll be down the tubes. And it will be because of people who put their false pride forward with their blinders on, not wanting to face reality.
If you brought a car into my shop and you wanted a new quarter panel, and I straightened it with bondo instead, and tried to cover it up and told you I put a new one on, so my profits would be higher, and in a year or so it shrunk and got wavy, would you be proud of that?. I wouldn't. You wouldn't come back. You'd tell everyone not to use me, and I'd eventually go out of business. I don't want this country to go out of business. Why do you think they are giving out 0% financiing to keep America rolling? Maybe we are getting into trouble here. I hope you are intelligent enough to realize that we need to start doing something. It should tick you off that there is a problem! And, not that someone noticed it?
Last edited by fatherlarry : 11-18-2001 at 06:37 PM.
Go have a beer and chill. I am talking about craftsmanship, not our country.
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It should tick you off that there is a problem! And, not that someone noticed it?
It does on occasion irritate me too. I also have a Subaru, a 91 Legacy. It doesn't burn oil, the interior is good, the weatherstripping is good. The body is good. It has almost 200k on it. It has a tap in the engine when I start it. I would put gas in it right now, change the oil, and drive straight thru to Los Angeles. That's not ant-American. That's just experience speaking.
Quality has always been a problem with American Automobiles. But, once again, the proof is in the pudding. As long as we keep buying, they will keep building them. I prefer not to be without my Vette.
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HallTech TRIC, B&M Ripper Shifter, MGW Anodized Pistol Grip shift knob, Stainless Screens, Illuminated Red Fuzzy Dice, Blue-yellow-green Scooby-Doo Steering Wheel Cover courtesy of my 5 year old grandson.
I took a 15 year break from Corvettes and American cars due to quality and performance issues during the 80's and 90's. Since 8/99 I have owned all C5 models a total of 5 new purchases. AMERICAN AUTOMAKERS HAVE COME A LONG WAY AND NOW RIVAL THE FOREIGN GUYS IN QUALITY, PERFORMANCE, TECHNOLOGY and exeed imports in VALUE BIG TIME. The Corvette, all versions, are a prime example. Since 9/11 I have made a comittment to myself to only purchase American made autos in the future and I have.
Some of my best friends are employed by US automakers.
Maybe you need to look at it from a different perspective. We get the performance of cars that cost $90,000 and more. Can I tolerate a few less stitches in my seats for that? Hell Yes!
In terms of initial quality, the Corvette is first in it's class - Premium Sports Cars. That's pretty damn stout when you consider the cost.
Should the things you mention be better? Sure. But I for one appreciate the chance of driving a car that'll run with the best from Stuttgart and having $40,000 cash in my pocket.
$50,000 may seem like a ton of money, but the Corvette is still one heck of a bargain.
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"'tis better to have zoomed and failed, than never to have zoomed at all." - Zoomin, 2001
Originally posted by fatherlarry Take the Z06. You have to pay more money, and they say "well, you have a German transmission in there". Why aren't we able to boast "I have an American transmission in my Vette". This should tell you something. Just a thought. Feel free to comment or tell me off if I am wrong.
Actually it's a Mexican Transmission as the Muncie/Getrag licensing and tooling went to Tremec. Nonetheless, the Corvette is an American car. I feel the engineering and execution to be very good actually.
All car manufacturers use suppliers to some degree.
I do appreciate the point you seem to be making. The Corvette quality can always be improved, as can any car.
I think you might find the quality of the 'vette to be superior to nearly all of the super-exotics.
Handling and power are what I look for. I don't think we've been shorted, nor is the car not a real "value" which is a term seldom used in the same breath when speaking "true" sports cars.
Originally posted by 1fastdog
I think you might find the quality of the 'vette to be superior to nearly all of the super-exotics.
After working on most exotics myself, especially Ferrari, Mazarati, Porsche, Lamborgini, there is a big difference, my friend. You get a great bang for the buck with a Corvette, but as most experts will tell you, that's just what it is....bang for the buck. You'd have to spend an awful lot of money to get the fit an finish that the exotics give you. Just in the paint work alone, the orange peel on the Vette, and on other American cars, leaves much to be desired. With all the gov't restrictions that are laid on American companies, especially the paint industry, the base-coat clear-coat that is used on the Corvette is much softer than and less durable than the foreign cars that don't have the gov't restrictions. I am not knocking American cars, but for $40,000-$50,000 I would like to see us be a little more competitive. We made the Europeons heads spin with the ZR1. Let's make them spin a little bit more.
Actually it's a Mexican Transmission as the Muncie/Getrag licensing and tooling went to Tremec. Nonetheless, the Corvette is an American car. I feel the engineering and execution to be very good actually.
B]
ACTUALLY the ZO6 Transmission is made in North Carolina
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Bill, Speedway White / Z06 With --plate--
FatherLarry, back in '95 I priced a ZR1 at about $65k. That's $84k in todays money and $34k more than an '02 Z06. IMHO, the Z06 and the other C5 models can be upgraded from factory specs into your DREAM sports car for alot less $$ overcoming the very minor flaws and adding all the goodies you desire. Fubu/Les
Originally posted by FUBU69 FatherLarry, back in '95 I priced a ZR1 at about $65k. That's $84k in todays money and $34k more than an '02 Z06. IMHO, the Z06 and the other C5 models can be upgraded from factory specs into your DREAM sports car for alot less $$ overcoming the very minor flaws and adding all the goodies you desire. Fubu/Les
The Z06 is a great hot rod as it was classified on a TV special on Speedvision. But you're talking two different animals. The ZR1 is an Indy dual overhead cam engine we are talking about here, with independent sleeves and top end speed that competes with the European exotics. As far as endurance and top end, there is no way that a push rod engine can hold up for as many hours as the ZR1 did at those speeds. And, I still don't think that the VW prototype with its 12 cylinders really did break the endurance record, which you can find more info on at ZR1.net. They're comparing a 12 cylinder to an 8 cylinder merc marine engine. The ZR1 is quite a beast, and is a classic within its own era, and it kept the Corvette image strong.
As far as spending $ to upgrade to a dream car. I am not talking about performance for the money. I'm talking about a little better quality for the money. You get the engineering in Cadillac also, but you get a better grade of quality, for the same price or less, from the same manufacturer. As far as mods, my 1957 E gaser which turned the low '9's in the late '60's used most of the technolgy that is being used today in the Z06, except for free floating pistons. I am not knocking the Corvette, but I am not the only Corvette lover that has brought up the quality issue, and its good feedback for GM. This is still not a CHEAP car by any means, and the quality issues like orange peel, stitching in the leather, panel fit, dashboard waves, wiring routing can be improved for not that much more expense. I wouldn't mind paying an extra grand for the car to see all those improvements. I appreciate your views, thanks.
Actually it's a Mexican Transmission as the Muncie/Getrag licensing and tooling went to Tremec. Nonetheless, the Corvette is an American car. I feel the engineering and execution to be very good actually.
Quote:
Originally posted by wt2ga
ACTUALLY the ZO6 Transmission is made in North Carolina
If 1fast says Mexico, you can take it to the bank.
ACTUALLY the ZO6 Transmission is made in North Carolina
The Getrag DIFFERENTIALS are made in the Carolinas.
"MN6" aka T-56, co-design w/Getrag, used to be made by Warner Automotive@ Warner Gear in Muncie IN, Tremec, under license, makes the trannies now in Mexico... Ole'
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I am talking about craftsmanship, not our country. 
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