Help, just finished my first HPDE, have lots of questions!

[Blackrazor]

Hey all,

Thanks to many people on this forum, I finally went out and tracked my C5Z for the first time... what an AWESOME experience. I feel like I've been wasting my life up until now, I am totally addicted to the track and I've only been once!

Anway, after my first HPDE, I've got a lot of questions.

1) I've decided that I need to get two sets of wheels, one for the track and one for the street. I'm running Nitto 555R2's on 18's all around, I'm going to switch them over to HPDE duty (I feel like I'm wasting them on the street now), and get another identical set of wheels shod with Michelin PS2's or something similar. Question is, will I need to reset the alignment every time I switch tires/wheels, or will I be fine swapping tires/wheels myself the night before the HPDE?

2) BRAKES!!! I've already got high temp fluid and ss braided brake lines, but I still feel like the brakes are the "weakest link" on a Z06 at a HPDE. Should I upgrade to two piece rotors (at least, at the front)? Right now I'm essentially running stock rotors with EBC "Yellow Stuff" pads. I worry that if I blow a pad or rotor, I'll be out for the rest of the HPDE, which would suck. Should I bring extra sets of pads and rotors to the track... would it be easier to replace rotors "in the field" if I switched over to 2-piece rotors? Also, since I'm running 18" wheels up front, shouldn't I be able to mount a larger rotor up front? Finally, I've noticed that my brake pedal is going all the way down to (or below!) the gas pedal, which makes it nearly impossible to heel-toe the car; is there a solution to this, or should I just raise the brake pedal an inch or so?

3) My radiator seemed to stay cool, but the engine oil temp hit 280 degrees! Is there a decent add-on oil cooler I can install to help with this? Is running at 280+ going to blow my motor?

4) The lug nuts came loose on my right front wheel, is this normal? I didn't check the torque before I went out, so I don't know what it was to start with, but I've since reset them to 100 lb-ft of torque. Do the wheel nuts need to be re-torqued between each stint on the track?

Thanks for any help, hopefully I'll get to see some of you at the track!

[UstaB-GS549]

1. My track alignment is also my street alignment. I don't change.

2. NAPA rotors are cost effective. When they crack, I can change one out in 15 minutes at the track. Pretty much any brake fluid boils. Get used to bleeding brakes.

3. Do a search on T1 coolers.

4. Lugs were not torqued or something unusual is happening. Torqued is torqued.

[DennyM]

[quote=Blackrazor]

Originally Posted by Blackrazor

1) I've decided that I need to get two sets of wheels, one for the track and one for the street. Question is, will I need to reset the alignment every time I switch tires/wheels, or will I be fine swapping tires/wheels myself the night before the HPDE?

To add to Ustab ...
You do not need to change the alignment because you switch tires/wheels. However, a track alignment is more aggressive (more negative camber; different toe settings) and if you wear an aggressive alignment on the street, wear on your street tires will suffer.

Originally Posted by Blackrazor

2) BRAKES!!! I've already got high temp fluid and ss braided brake lines, ...
Should I upgrade to two piece rotors (at least, at the front)? Right now I'm essentially running stock rotors with EBC "Yellow Stuff" pads. I worry that if I blow a pad or rotor, I'll be out for the rest of the HPDE, which would suck. Should I bring extra sets of pads and rotors to the track... would it be easier to replace rotors "in the field" if I switched over to 2-piece rotors? Also, since I'm running 18" wheels up front, shouldn't I be able to mount a larger rotor up front? Finally, I've noticed that my brake pedal is going all the way down to (or below!) the gas pedal, which makes it nearly impossible to heel-toe the car; is there a solution to this, or should I just raise the brake pedal an inch or so?

What fluid are you using? Is it fresh? DOT4 is more hydroscopic and it's the wet boiling point that matters ...
If you're getting a soft pedal, it's usually hot fluid or air in the lines.

It may be worn pads too, or pad taper, or spread calipers, etc.
Two piece rotors will keep your hubs cooler; I don't think it's faster to disassemble two-piece rotors than to change solid rotors.
Yes, you can mount a larger rotor.
You should not be at a point where rotors don't last for a while. You might consider other pads. Not too many followers of EBC pads ... I've got EBC greens on a '99 Saab; impressed with their thickness, but they are inferior to stock pads in braking.
IMHO, you should NOT have to alter your pedals ... good pads with at least 50% pad life remaining, fresh fluid, and brake cooling ducts are first things ... and yes... bleed daily if doing 2-day events.

Originally Posted by Blackrazor

3) My radiator seemed to stay cool, but the engine oil temp hit 280 degrees! Is there a decent add-on oil cooler I can install to help with this? Is running at 280+ going to blow my motor?

280 is tolerable. Consensus is that getting too much above that is cause for short-shifting into a higher gear, or coming off track. There are many aftermarket oil cooler kits or oil coolers and lines/blocks you can buy separately if inclined.

Originally Posted by Blackrazor

4) The lug nuts came loose on my right front wheel, is this normal? I didn't check the torque before I went out, so I don't know what it was to start with, but I've since reset them to 100 lb-ft of torque. Do the wheel nuts need to be re-torqued between each stint on the track?

Odd ... even the most cursory tech checks the lug nuts.
Don't torque them hot ...

[blkZ06]

Originally Posted by UstaB-GS549

1. My track alignment is also my street alignment. I don't change.

2. NAPA rotors are cost effective. When they crack, I can change one out in 15 minutes at the track. Pretty much any brake fluid boils. Get used to bleeding brakes.

3. Do a search on T1 coolers.

4. Lugs were not torqued or something unusual is happening. Torqued is torqued.

exactly what he said

I've done about 40 HPDE wknds in the past 3 yrs and have always run my stock rotors, DOT 4 brake fluid, street tires, stock alignment and carbotech race pads (XP 10's are very rotor friendly)...and I have LOTS of brake I check the torque and tire pressure at the beginning of the day and at lunch break, also try to check tire pressure/tire wear right after each run.

I was hitting 300+ on the oil temp too so I got the DRM integrated cooler. Last wknd at Gingerman I MAYBE got up to 230 degrees and it was after a 30 min session with 90 degree weather.

Glad you got the bug, now you need to go to the Z06fest in October and run the HPDE at Putnam with all the Z06 crowd

[WB6HRO]

Tires, Keep the Nittos for the street. Get a set of Kuhmo V710's or Hoosier R6's.

Add the Doug Rippe Brake ducts and Phoenix or LG spindle brackets to get air on the rotor.

Napa rotors at $25 to $28 the only way to go.

I've been running Porterfield R4 race pads, noisy on street. The R4S pad is a good street and occasional track pad.

Install a heat sheilding on the clutch line where it goes past the header. I also use racing brake fluid in the clutch.

The Doug Rippie radiator kit with oil cooler built in the radiator is the only way to go for a street car or oil wil run to cold. It's a Ron Davis Radiator, same core as in the C5R.

Also put in a 5 or 6 point harness.

[Dr Chill]

If you're serious about spending more time on the track, you can go two routes. The first is all out spare little expense, and the other is on a tight budget. I did the low cost way for the past 3 years, but now am doing it right (not that the other way is wrong) the second time around. I've always tried to buy parts used in excellent condition for 50-70% cost of new.

Most cost effective:

Absolute necessities not in any particualr order:
1) oil cooling-Dewitt or Ron Davis Integrated rad/oc vs. external oil cooler. The external oc is less expensive but you don't get the added benefit of superior engine cooling from a high capacity aluminum radiator
2) C6Z06 Brake ducts and cooling hose
3) NAPA or equivalent $25 rotors-replace fronts every 1-2 track days
4)Castrol SRF-pricey but lasts 1 year and rarely requires bleeding
5) Track/street compromise alignment
6) Harness Bar and 5 point harness
7)Nitto R2/toyo RA1/Nitto NT01/Mich PSC tires for street and track
8)If you have a tire trailer or plan on taking your car to the track on a trailer, you can use a second set of rims/tires. 4 rear Z06 rims with scrubs or $150 GY slicks from CCW is most cost effective.

More expensive additional options in order of my recommendation:
1) Racing Seat-makes a huge difference. Keeps you planted and allows for more speed
2) Light weight rims-used CCW track rims can usually be had for <$1400
3)A great brake upgrade is the new Baer 6 piston Monoblock kit with 14" heavy duty 2 piece rotors that currently can be purchased at TByrne and another non sponsor vendor for $2130. Other kits by Stoptech or Brembo are also highly recommended but are more costly. Wilwoods IMO are inferior to the other 3 I mentioned. You will definitely stop better for longer track runs with better heat dissipation.
4)Suspension upgrade with shocks/T1 sways/possibly coilovers but $$
5) Heads/Cam upgrade-higher power but less reliabilty and rough idle

[Blackrazor]

I'm definitely serious, but I think I have more issues than I thought!

However, that is also the source of my two biggest problems: Heat.... and heat! When I took the car to the track, I noticed that the engine oil got up to 280 really fast! I need to add some kind of aftermarket oil cooler.

[undertaker]

heat is definetely your enemy......i have a forged 346 with 15 pounds of boost in my 03.....via sts.....still have the brake ducts, i have the DRM extensions and spindle ducts I'll still kill rotors over 2 days at watkins glen.....but I do run race pads on the track..they're night and day compared to street pads. For cooling I have a dewitts with teh oil cooler, its better, but I'm still running into heat issues, not the oil so much (280 is okay, 300 is okay with synthetic...still in its operating range) but my coolant can go to 260 still if I get on it hard for a few laps. For tires.....I love my R2's I run them on the street, of course my rear tires are somewhat bald so I had an extra set of wheels and grabbed my buddy's F1 takeoffs when he picked up a set of R2s after trying mine. I just picked up a set of ccw track wheels with R6's on them and its night and day...I kick the abs in during hard braking and I can feel the inside rear tire lifting on some turn-ins....pretty much I'm past the oem springs/sways/shocks etc. My master plan for the winter is coilovers, T1 sways and big brakes (even though I've been doing okay with stock stuff with good fluid, stainless lines, race pads and a pile of rotors in the trailer)

HPDE is addicting.....you have been warned.

Also go for a ride along in a car with harnesses......I hate driving a car without harnesses (spring mountain for instance) on the track now.....you spend half your energy trying to keep yourself centered in the seat vs driving the car.

Also with harnesses, our local groups have a new ruling that the shoudler belts have to go thru the seat not over it (which stock C5Z seats would require) race seat is an option, picking up a set of used sport seats from a coupe/vert is an option although the wiring is different, or you can convert your stock seats to sport seats (what I did) www.eastcoastsupercharging.com on the left sells a seat cover kit with real leather covers (not inserts like oem) that look dynamite and keep you planted in the seats, not on the level of race seats for sure, but a drastic improvement in comfort, stability and looks

[Blackrazor]

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