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How reliable are these cars as track cars?

8K views 26 replies 18 participants last post by  HarrisRacing 
#1 ·
I'm thinking about getting a C5 Z06 as a track day car. How reliable are they? What do I have to look out for or pay special attention too? What are some of the weak points?

Also what is your typical setup for HPDE events? I'm not looking to mod too crazy (not yet anyway ;)). Just some minor bolt on stuff.

Thanks.

-Scott
 
#2 ·
Scott,

First, welcome to the forum! :z: You would learn a lot from doing some searches and I'm sure others will add info. Do a search for 99Cobra as he has a dedicated '03 Z06 track car and has posted some good stuff. The car is awesome for the track, but you need to prep it with brakes and the proper fluids, and you will find a whole list of stuff already posted. Good luck on finding the right Z06 for your track needs! :thumb:

Bob :cool:
 
#3 · (Edited)
Just wanted to say welcome to :z: first.
Out of the box the Z is closest to track ready of any Vette, and the only thing you really have to address early on is heat ... starting with brake fluid.
No time rite now, but there are bunches of threads on HPDE prep ...
 
#4 · (Edited)
Thanks guys. :zboobie:

I think I've found the right Z06. It's just a matter of pulling the trigger on it. There are other cars I'm considering as well. An Evo IX and 911 SC are the other main two contenders. The Z06 and Evo would be street/track cars while the 911 would be a dedicated track car.


As for the brakes, can you just upgrade to SS lines, track pads, and DOT 4 fluid, or should you really get a Big Brake Kit?

What about overheating the engine and tranny? I've heard those are possible problems? Is that something to be concerned about? How easy is it to address those?

Thanks.

-Scott
 
#5 · (Edited)
Overheating is the only real reliability issue you'll have to handle. That said, a stock Z06 can take a lot of abuse before sustaining any physical damage. If you're looking for a car that you can take to the track once a month you theorhetically dont need to do anything aside from going to a better brake fluid and adding some oil (potentially going to one with higher viscousity, for the trans and diff too). But if you want a car that won't experience brake fade, and will be able to sustain this abuse for dozens of HARD laps, every month, for years, you might find yourself spending a bit more.

Start out with pads, something simple that you dont have to change every time you hit the track, like Hawk HPS... I use Carbotech XP8/PP and they're great pads, but the noise tends to be a bit excessive. Get a dot 4 fluid (it doesnt have to be super expensive: you're not a racer; I use Wilwood 570, which I bought from Summit). If you really want to keep your brakes cool, get some cooling ducts; though I must admit, they aren't the nicest things to install as you have to cut through the inner fender. When I did mine I mauled up the inner fender pretty bad and once I was done had to make a patch panel and rivet it in (turned out beautiful but wasn't what I'd call "bolt on", though it wasn't very hard either). They don't offer the wheels much clearance either (no matter what you do) and they will rub at full lock, so I leave the spindle duct holders off until track days. You don't need big brakes unless you're really looking to turn in better times rather than just have fun, unless you want the bling factor.

When you feel up to it, I hear oil, trannie, and diff coolers are the way to go, but can be rather pricey.

If you want to go faster thats another thing all together.

Good luck,
Bryan
 
#6 ·
Ditto on what panda said. I go to the track once every 2-3months and was there this past Tuesday. Oil temp and tranny temp where the only items I really keep my eye one. I have gotten the hot tranny temp alarm a couple of times. I also drive this car everyday. So I it is an awesome all around car that nothing car compare to for the $$$.
 
#7 ·
I agree with WeirdPanda and Electron Blue. My car is mostly stock and is holding up well after 50+ track days in two-years. I have done vastly similar things as WeirdPanda and I manage to beat-up on most everything else on the track.

I have learned to respect selected drivers in Evo's, S2000 and Porsches though. Evo's can be made to go really fast as can the S2000s although reliability always seems to be an issue for those with modded engines. So those cars are good choices, too.
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
 
#8 ·
This is my 3rd season with my 02 Z06. I can't afford much in the way of mods, so my set-up is pretty simple. More negative camber and zero toe in the front. Royal Purple in the trans and diff. Probably any brand name synthetic would work as well. Carbotech brake pads and Valvoline Syntec, Castrol LMA or ATE Super Blue brake fluid (fresh is most important quality here). Used DOT R compound road race tires that I buy from other racers. Carry spare front and rear rotors ($25 "NAPA" type), because they crack when cooling down if you are driving fast enough (it's a C5 thing).

I run competitive times with this relatively stock set-up. You can do a lot more depending on your budget, but seat time is the real equalizer.
 
#9 · (Edited)
OK, I have a few minutes now. I prolly line up with Electron Blue above, in that I have 12 HPDE days and am in my third year. I am not hard on my car ... not hard on brakes, but I do run it hard enough to see oil temps approaching 280 on hot days. Never had trans temp warning lite go on.
DOT 4 brake fluid
Speedbleeders
SS BL
Currently Hawk HP+ pads (will prolly go to Carbotech as a track-specific pad next year)
Titanium backing plates on pads.
DRM Brake Ducts
Phoenix Spindle Mounts (LGM mounts are more effective, but more involved install)
home made heat shields on lower tie rod ends (rotor heat)
Lowered on stock bolts
Spare set of NAPA rotors in the basement, will go on with next set of pads.
Amsoil synthetic in Tranny and Diff
This summer I ran 10x40 Amsoil & filter
Now I'm on 5x30 Mobil 1 & filter
Next fill will either be Amsoil 0w30 or Amsoil 10w40, depending on when and what's ahead.
All running on stock F1SC's ... I will not go to track tires until I have enough seat time and skill to get the max out of the stockers ... since I don't trailer, I might get a set of Nitto 555 RII's that I can drive on to Summit Pt (about 40 miles).
Looking hard at an integrated radiator/oil cooler next. ... I run the AC until I get on track, and immediately on pit in.
 
#12 ·
drivinhard said:
Saw an article in a recent vette mag with a modified FRC vs a 06 Z06 at road atlanta (both on GY Street rubber) @ 1:35 range.

What's a good lap time for a C5 Z06 on race rubber at Road Atlanta, mostly stock?
I am not sure I buy that time; that is flying, esp on street tires. The Speed World Challenge GT cars run in the mid-to-low 1:20s. The SWC Touring cars run about 1:33-plus at best.

If you get into the 1:40s on DOT R street rubber, like a V700, with a stock C5-Z06, I think you are doing pretty well.
 
#13 ·
sab0276 said:
How complex and expensive are oil, trannie, and diff coolers? -Scott
Figure a grand for radiator & oil cooler (+ labor)
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101433&highlight=cooler
Trans cooler in same range ...
here's a thread. LGM sells a mechanical trans/diff cooler (different opinions on manual or electric ... pros and cons on each side)
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98678&highlight=cooler
DRM Diff cooler install:
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97726&highlight=cooler
More oil cooler stuff:
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97455&highlight=cooler
"war stories"
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99790&highlight=cooler
 
#15 ·
How reliable? I know of 14 that have seen track time, either HPDE or racing. Of those 14, 5 have blown engines, 3 having done so twice. I know of 2 others who have had failed clutches and one with a failed tranny.

Overheating the oil in the engine and/or tranny is relatively common. Almost everyone has experienced that, including myself (both when stock). The water temp can also rise but isn't quite as common.

The stock brakes are junk for the track. At the least you need to replace the pads and brake fluid. The more cooling air you can get to them, the better. It's best to use separate pads and rotors. Aftermarket brake systems are vastly superior in this regard, plain and simple.

If you run race rubber, an Accusump is a wise investment. Even without it's still a good idea. Engine Oil and differential coolers are also a very good idea and are OEM on the C6 Z for this reason.

It's a lot of fun and they are good performers but they do need some work to be more reliable, although no track car is totally reliable.
 
#16 ·
This is a copy of a post I made regarding a brake thread. I think it also fits here as a testiment to the c6Z.

"I have tracked my car very seriously since I aquired it last Sept. Last weekend my Z06 went over 4000 track miles. I switched over to StopTech's very early on, after experiencing the same type of problems. I have done a complete make over of the stock setup. Stop Tech Brakes, Performance Friction 03 pads, SS lines, cooling ducts, coilovers, alignment, wheels, Hoosier Vrl slicks, and a few under hood mods, to get the car to be the track monster that it was always ment to be. Today it is as good on the track as a "street car" can be.
However I rarely street the car, 5700 miles on the car overall. The engine has prob seen as many near redline shifts as any C6 Z out there, and has had zero problems. On the track it out runs the best "streetable cars". (F430, GT3, SRT,FGT etc.). So with a few expensive and a few not so expensive mods the C6 Z can be almost, as good on the track on as a TRUE factory race car like the comp coup Snake."
 
#17 ·
Thanks for all of the input guys, I appreciate it. I think I am going to get the 911 though (too good of a deal).
I hope to get a Z06 when I get bored with it and want something with more power. :)

Any of you guys run with Chin Motorsports/TracQuest? I usually go to the WGI and VIR events with them. Maybe I'll see some of you guys there.

-Scott
 
#21 ·
This is resurrecting an old thread. Just bought the ron davis rad w/ int oil cooler, cuz I got a jones to keep up with the big boys again, and 300 plus deg eng oil temp distracts me from the job at hand. Also been looking at big brakes(speed costs money...) then I remembered that Scotty B and CindyLux just burn their red calipers brown, and change them out, while being only 3 secs off the GT-1 class times at Seattle. Comparo: me-1.38, T-1 racers-1.32.5s, Scotty and Cindy in showroom stock z06's-1.30.xx, GT-1- 1.27's all at Seattle
How's everybody doing?
 
#22 · (Edited)
Here's what I did to prep for tracking my car. Keep in mind I'm the original owner and the poor car only has 14K miles on it :)

Replace rotors and bed in set of Carbotech XP8 pads all around.
Install Speedbleeders
Install stainless brake lines
Purge brake fluid and replace with DOT 5.1
Install Doug Rippie Brake cooling ducts with Phoenix spindle mounts on the front.

I drove the car HARD for 2 track days and found out that street tires are the limiting factor. No brake fade, no overheating, no worries. It was over 90 degrees outside with absurd Alabama humidity in the 80-90% range and the car was flawless. I drove there. I drove home. I'm going again in September :)

Chin Motorsports has more openings for Barber on 15/16 Sep. It is a gorgeous facility.
 
#23 ·
In line with XFordGuy ...
I'm the original owner and the poor car only has 20K miles on it :)

Install Speedbleeders
Install stainless brake lines
Purge brake fluid and replace with DOT4
Install Doug Rippie Brake cooling ducts with Phoenix spindle mounts on the front.
Hawk HP + pads
Titanium backing plates on pads (mitigates heat transfer)
Lowered on stock bolts
Synthetic trans and diff fluid
DOT4 iteratively cycled thru the clutch MC reservoir
Regular bleeds around events.
Drove three years on stock tires ... I drove the car moderately hard over about 12 track days (saw oil temps approaching 290 most times and then backed it off.
No brake fade, no overheating, no worries.
Then ... put on a set of Nitto 555RII's
Replaced rotors and installed Carbotech XP10/8 pads.
Installed '04 C5Z shocks

Oh ... I put in a custom welded 4-pt roll bar ... but on to cooling ...
I'm also putting in a DRM RD Rad with integrated (right side) EOC after an autox this weekend.
Biggest PITA I see is pulling the wire harness for fans off the shroud.
NOTE: Randy says the pressure hose connects to the FRONToutlet of the adapter and runs to the bottom inlet.

Running 1.2 front, 0.9 rear camber ... not enough for the Nittos ... I was rolling the outside edges big time at VIR ... going to 1.5 front and rear ... 0 toe front (I have to drive to track) and 1/16 to 1/8 toe in on rear.)
Near future ... PolyGraphite bushings ... and watch the hubs ...
 
#24 ·
... going to 1.5 front and rear ... 0 toe front (I have to drive to track) and 1/16 to 1/8 toe in on rear.)
Denny,
Not that you'll be able to get that much in the rear, but I think you'll want nearer -1.0 in the rear for two reasons. I think that with more, the car will tend strongly towards understeer (too much grip in the rear) - however note that this is safe, just not fast. And, I think that too much negative camber in the rear makes it hard to put down the power coming out of slow speed corners. On my stock suspension, I used -1.7 in the front, -1.0 in the rear and was pretty happy with it... other than the rapid front tire inner edge wear experienced on the street portion of my driving.
 
#26 ·
I'm running DRM front brake coolers, Goodrige SS lines w/ AN fittings, and Wilwood H pads (or Carbotech XP12/XP10s).

I have a dewitts racing radiator w/ left side EOC (enclosed oil cooler) and my max oil temp after 25 min in 95+ degrees at VIR was 276. The left side is the hot side of the radiator, but it allows for easier line routing and the oil gets to temp nicely in the winter which is good as I still drive on the street often.

I've never had a trans temp warning, but I do run full synthetics. I also have my exhaust ceramic coated w/ black turbo coating, but even before that I had no issues w/ trans heat.

My father's stock '04 got the warning our first time out last summer so we pulled down the stock mid-pipe and wrapped it with header wrap where it passes under the trans, we also upgraded to syn fluids... no more issues at all!

Stock


Wrapped


In
 
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