My First HPDE!!! Sebring Int. Raceway, FL.

[ZO6 NTHEWIND]

Getting back to what SOMEGUY604 said in his original post;

I would HIGHLY recommend tires! I saw so many people have traction problems out there, and i didnt have ANY what so ever. And i made sure i had all the right higher up fluids b/c i wanted to protect everything as best i could.


I know I'm not going to be buying new tires before the Z Fest (maybe after the event) LOL! and my trip to Putnam Park, but I'm sure that good tires do make a big difference.
Great post! Glad to hear what another person has to say about a HPDE.

I just bought my Z and I wasn't able to drive it very much before I had to go back to work, I travel a lot. Every time I drove the car it brought a to my face.

Later

[DennyM]

Originally Posted by SomeGuy604

Honestly i dont know, but i do know that my oil pressure needle above my water temp did what it normally does under hard acceleration... nothing higher then it normally goes, if that helps at all. Why? What is a safe temp and what is too high? I can check the next time i go in like a month.

Good on the tires and student-instructor experience
Best to run with your oil temp displayed on the DIC.
There's no solid "number" but some see numbers north of 300 degrees on oil and keep running; others start short-shifting and dialing back above 280.
I start dialing back when I get above 280 ... but I tend to be conservative ... FWIW ...
Enjoy your new addiction!

[SomeGuy604]

Originally Posted by DennyM

Good on the tires and student-instructor experience
Best to run with your oil temp displayed on the DIC.
There's no solid "number" but some see numbers north of 300 degrees on oil and keep running; others start short-shifting and dialing back above 280.
I start dialing back when I get above 280 ... but I tend to be conservative ... FWIW ...
Enjoy your new addiction!

May i ask... what happenes if you run the oil temp too high for a prolonged period of time?

[mjustmike]

Originally Posted by DennyM

Good on the tires and student-instructor experience
Best to run with your oil temp displayed on the DIC.
There's no solid "number" but some see numbers north of 300 degrees on oil and keep running; others start short-shifting and dialing back above 280.
I start dialing back when I get above 280 ... but I tend to be conservative ... FWIW ...
Enjoy your new addiction!

Denny,
That is what I was told also...in the 280-300 range it's time to ease back some. Push it too far and damage will follow, if you are able to get that high on a regular basis then you may want to consider a radiator/cooler combo or seperate oil cooler.

[DennyM]

Originally Posted by SomeGuy604

May i ask... what happenes if you run the oil temp too high for a prolonged period of time?

Fair question ... and deserving of more than just "opinions"
My index is that the Trans "high temp" warning is set to display on the DIC at 280, I think. Since a Trans is a lot less complicated , and the parts protected from contact are moving a lot slower, I figured that 280 would be a good high-end limit.
Another indicator ... ElephantRacing.com shows a graph of viscosity loss at temps increase. Graph runs from 180 to 280, and stops there.
"When oil is the proper temperature the moving parts operate in hydrodynamic lubrication, are not in contact and wear very little. With rising temperature viscosity drops and metal-to-metal contact begins. Engine wear is greatly accelerated."
I figured that if they didn't graph beyond 280, that would be an indicator ...
HTH ...

[SomeGuy604]

Originally Posted by DennyM

My index is that the Trans "high temp" warning is set to display on the DIC at 280, I think. Since a Trans is a lot less complicated , and the parts protected from contact are moving a lot slower, I figured that 280 would be a good high-end limit.

Are you saying that this will come up on the DIC automatically when it hits that temp? Or do i need to set one of the functions like you mentioned with the oil temperature?

b/c nothing popped up on my DIC on any of my runs. The only thing that ever popped up was the Active Handling when that kicked in. No warning flashes for anything else though.

[mjustmike]

By using your options button on the right side of the pod, you can set the DIC to display your oil temp, or pressure....and with your page display on the left side of the pod, you can change the HUD display for your viewing on the windshield.
The warning that will pop up automatically is the trans temp...well also the Active Handling, Traction Control. Well actually there are a few others also, but of what we are thinking of for this thread....
I used to run the oil temp displayed constantly, where the "Corvette by Chevrolet" displays when you start up. You don't want to make a habit of jumping into her with the oil temp below 140. I would even back down from a Mustang not to rev over 3K until the temps were up. No disrespect to the Mustang....just didn't want to damage my LS6.

[Subdriver]

My thoughts on oil temps and tracking the C5 Z06:

There is no magic number for any oil above which is bad and below which is okay. Like any liquid, as it heats up, oil thins... and it thins probably more than you'd think. At about 100F, a typical 5w30's viscosity is on the order of 58 cSt. At 212F, it's down to 10-11 cSt, which is normal operating temp for our engines. As oil temp climbs to 300F, the typical 30 weight oil's viscosity has dropped to about 3 - 3.5!!!

That viscosity is about 30% of the normal viscosity at our normal operating temp, and about 5% of what it is when the engine is cold (at 100F). The result? Lower oil pressure, lower protection for highly loaded components like the bearings. As an FYI, I lost my original stock motor in my first season, so I'm a little sensitive to this issue.

For the above reasons, I did two things. First, I installed an oil cooler. Second, I run a higher viscosity oil. With my oil cooler, my temps on a hot track day are around 254F or so. With the 10w40 I run, this puts my oil pressure at about normal for what it would be with a 30 grade oil running at 212F.

In my 02 Z06 I use the AMSOIL SAE 10w40 Marine Synthetic Motor Oil because this oil isn't limited by the new, more restrictive API SM standards, was designed for sustained high rpm, high load conditions (like on the track), and contains rust inhibitors (which helps my frequently stored car). I think this shows in the this oil's High Temp High Shear (HTHS) rating of 4.6, the same as the Mobil 1 EP 15w50, but in a 40 weight oil.

The High Temperature/High Shear Test measures a lubricant’s viscosity under severe high temperature and shear conditions that are similar to severe service applications in an engine. Here is a listing of HTHS numbers I recently pulled off various manufacturers websites. This shows that while the Mobil 1 0w40 has a much higher HTHS rating that the Mobil 1 5w30, there are better choices if you are going to stray from the owner's manual requirements.

Amsoil Series 2000 20w50 (API SM) – 5.8
Amsoil Premium Protection 20w50 (API SL) – 5.0
Amsoil Marine Synthetic 10w40 (API SL) – 4.6
Mobil 1 EP 15w50 (API SM) – 4.6
Pennzoil Marine SAE 40 (API SJ) – 4.5
Amsoil Heavy Duty Diesel 15w40 (CI-4+) – 4.4
Amsoil Premium Protection 10w40 (API SL) – 4.3
Amsoil XL 10w40 (API SM) – 4.3
Pennzoil Truck/SUV 15w40 (CI-4+) – 4.3
Pennzoil Long Life Heavy Duty 15w40 (API SL) – 4.3
Amsoil Premium Diesel 5w40 (CJ-4) – 4.2
Mobil 1 High Mileage 10w40 (API SL) – 4.06
Pennzoil Marine 15w40 (API SL) – 4.0
Amsoil European 5w40 (API SM) – 3.7
Mobil 1 High Mileage 10w30 (API SL) – 3.66
Amsoil Marine Motor 10w30 (API SL) – 3.64
Mobil 1 0w40 (API SM) – 3.6
Amsoil Heavy Duty Diesel 5w30 (CI-4+) – 3.5
Pennzoil Long Life Heavy Duty (API SL) – 3.5
Pennzoil Marine SAE 30 (API SJ) – 3.5
Amsoil Series 2000 0w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil SAE 10w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil SAE 5w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil XL 5w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil XL 10w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil XL 5w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Pennzoil Platinum 10w30 (API SM) – 3.15 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Mobil 1 10w30 (API SM) – 3.14 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Mobil 1 EP 10w30 (API SM) – 3.1
Mobil 1 EP 5w30 (API SM) – 3.1
Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 (API SM) – 3.1 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Pennzoil Truck/SUV 10w30 (API SM) – 3.1
Mobil 1 5w30 (API SM) – 3.09 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Mobil 1 Truck/SUV 5w30 (API SM) – 3.09
Pennzoil Truck/SUV 5w30 (API SM) – 3.0
Mobil 1 0w30 (API SM) – 2.99 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil SAE 0w20 (API SM) – 2.8
Amsoil XL 5w20 (API SM) – 2.7
Mobil 1 EP 5w20 (API SM) – 2.7
Mobil 1 5w20 (API SM) – 2.62
Mobil 1 0w20 (API SM) – 2.61
Pennzoil Platinum 5w20 (API SM) – 2.6
Pennzoil Truck/SUV 5w30 (API SM) – 2.6
Pennzoil Platinum 0w20 (API SM) – 2.6

Data verified from corporate websites May 07.
Note: Many companies such as Shell Rotella T and Royal Purple do not list HTHS ratings

[Olitho]

Wow Brad! That was a little vague and not thoroughly researched....

[ZO6 NTHEWIND]

And I'll add a double WOW!

Thanks for the information. Who would have thought to use a marine oil!!?
It makes really good sense for the reasons you gave.
All my cars ,(and other toys) sit for long periods at a time because I travel all the time with my job.
I've got about 5 different oils in my garage. One for the HD's another for the quads, one for my 69 Vette and still another for my wifes 95 Vette. Then there are the pickups, 90 F150 and a '03 GMC 2500 HD. And now with the 'new' ZO6 add still another.
I'll be changing all the fluids in the Z for the Z fest. I'm getting some great information here.
Thanks!

[SomeGuy604]

Did the engine have any problem switching over to 10w40?

And do you think if you ran just the 10w40 oil without an oil cooler, that it would still be better then the stock 5w30?

I ask this b/c im not precisely sure when i would be able to get an oil cooler. I still have to wait and see what my oil temps are running at come next event as well.

Thanks Brad.

[Subdriver]

Originally Posted by Olitho

Wow Brad! That was a little vague and not thoroughly researched....

I know, but I've been a little busy lately. I'll try to dig up some more data, due a few more used oil analysis samples and really try to flesh out that info for you.

Actually, I've made that post before so other than checking the various manufacturers websites every once in a while to check for reformulations changes to the HTHS specs, it isn't much more than a cut and paste for me.

Originally Posted by SomeGuy604

Did the engine have any problem switching over to 10w40?

And do you think if you ran just the 10w40 oil without an oil cooler, that it would still be better then the stock 5w30?

For me it wasn't an issue at all. With the higher viscosity oil, warming up your oil becomes very important. If you romp on it with cold 40 weight oil, your oil pressure is going to skyrocket and the oil bypass valve on the pump will open to limit pressure. Thus the pump will essentially be recirculating and while you'll have good pressure, the full oil flow of the pump won't be going through the motor. As a result, even with my daily driver CTS-V, I won't increase rpm over 3000 rpm or so until my oil temp is over 150F. At the track, this usually isn't an issue. Warm up the car before the session, take the first lap easy (a good idea anyways) and by the time I'm on the main straight for my 2nd lap (or race start if the first lap was a pace lap), the oil temp is usually well over 150F.

I do think that a 10w40 is much better than a 5w30 for the track for a stock C5 Z06 since the car didn't come with an oil cooler. In a stock car, the oil will get even hotter than it does in mine and I feel that the higher viscosity provided by the 40 weight oil is even more important than it is in a car with an oil temp. My rough seat of the pants guidelines: If your hot oil temp is about 200-230F, I'd stick with the 30 weight, 230-280F or so, I'd consider a 40 weight, and over 280F, I'd seriously consider a 50 weight (and be very very careful with warmup). The whole goal is to have the oil's viscosity be near the nominal 10-11 cSt of the stock 30 weight at 212F. As oil temp climbs, you need a heavier and heavier oil to meet that goal.

For those thinking about switching to AMSOIL, please consider the AMSOIL Preferred Customer Program which allows you to buy at wholesale, the same price I pay as a dealer and about 25% under retail. Please drop me a PM if you have any questions on the program.

[SomeGuy604]

Thanks Brad!

I will definatly check all my temps next time i go out and see where i am at.