[NDOMTUS]

I just placed an order for the Donaldson blackwing for my 2001 and was wondering who else has one, how real are the performance gains, and what other members have for an intake. I would have to say the motivating factor was seeing a picture of the 2001 and 2002 stock intakes and seeing the restrictive difference on the 2001. Sux!! :-x

Also, anyone running the blackwing with the TPIS long tube headers? Gains on these together...and of course including the power duct?

Thanks!

 

[SMFCPACFP]

I have one. THe performance gains are 0 hp and torque according to a member's own test on a dyno immediately before and after the install. My SOTP confirms that.

If you mean by performance, filtering out particles of a smaller micron size and durablility you have a winner, but for greater hp and torque, you are wasting your money.:guiness:

 

[Gordy M]

If you just order the front cover for the 2002 and put it on you car it is worth about 2 hp according to the Z06 engine engineer. For about $65 it is cheap hp. add a K&N air filter and you have another 2 hp. Again from the above source.

 

[gbjerke]

I saw the same pics posted...the '01/'02 air boxes....had a massive brain fart and can't find this post. Would love to find that again....any good scouts out there that want to do a good deed for today? (It's called helping the elderly). Thanks.

 

[NDOMTUS]

I saw the same pics posted...the '01/'02 air boxes....had a massive brain fart and can't find this post. Would love to find that again....any good scouts out there that want to do a good deed for today? (It's called helping the elderly). Thanks.

Here is a link showing the different air boxes.

http://www.c5registry.com/2k2z06/page3.htm


I know this debate has been ongoing on the different forums and I hear what some of you are saying about no performance gains, but what about the fact that the 2002 box looks to have 4 times the opening than for the 2001? Why would they make this change if the 2001 box was not restrictive? If I plan to increase my exhaust capacity (new headers), would not changing the intake to something less restrictive (more in for more out) help?

I really appreciate everyones input. :cheers:

 

[KMeloney]

I have a Donaldson on my '01. I also have TPIS headers on it. What I DON'T have is hard (dyno) data, but I know I'm making more power.

Whereas I'm no engineer, I'd have to say that the Donaldson DID improve the engine's breathing. When I put the intake in, did it feel like I had just put 4.10's in the rear? No, but then again I didn't expect there to be a big SOTP gain. Rather, I'd say the throttle response picked up.

Now, I'm sure the Donaldson is a big plus to the (TPIS) headers. To make more power, you need to get more air into the engine, and you need to get the exhaust out faster. That's clearly what's happening with the combination, 'cause the results are VERY noticeable.

Would the headers do as well with a restricted airbox? There's no way. Does the Donaldson by itself make the car run 10's? Of course not. But the COMBO works very nicely.

Making these -- and ANY -- cars fast is all about finding the right combo. Just adding aftermarket parts and adding up their manufacturer's HP claim numbers doesn't make a car fast. Some parts work together, and some don't.

For those who are suggesting that the Donaldson (and other better-breathing intakes) is/are a "waste," I think you're being foolish. Letting more air into the motor is always a GOOD thing when trying to make power. And, afterall, how many people who are interested in making the car perform better stop with just an air filter? Most people will make some more modifications to the car that will bennefit from an aftermarket intake. Even if I had stopped with the Donaldson (and not added headers), I'd feel confident that the intake was allowing more air into the engine, and that's just not a bad thing.

-Kirk

 

[NDOMTUS]

I appreciate your feedback from someone with a setup much like I'm looking at KMeloney. If you do get some dyno numbers from your car, please share as I would love to get some numbers on the actual improvement with these mods. I'm sure there are others that are curious about what this combination of more intake, more exhaust out can do for everyone.

What has been on the back of my mind has been some changes I've seen with the torque numbers, more HP but decrease in torque. Why would this happen?

And of course, anyone care to take a guess on the HP gain from the following combo:

385HP Z06 01 + blackwing + power duct + TPIS long tubes = ?

I may add some stickers in the future too...

 

[Zippy]

I've used the Donaldson on my past three C'5 and love the increased sound....can not comment on any hp gains, but I like it for the sound and increased air flow into the engine.

Zippy

 

[NDOMTUS]

I've used the Donaldson on my past three C'5 and love the increased sound....can not comment on any hp gains, but I like it for the sound and increased air flow into the engine.

Zippy

A difference in sound with the blackwing? Cool! Lets see what happens with them bolted on with the TPISers.

What about the bassani x-pipe? Yay...nay? I hear a good add on to avoid the poppin and since I aint got the poppin now, hopin to avoid it after mod....

 

[KMeloney]

What has been on the back of my mind has been some changes I've seen with the torque numbers, more HP but decrease in torque. Why would this happen?

I'm no engineer... But, from what I know, torque is the ability to turn the axle, and HP is... Well, different. :lol: Sorry, I don't know what the definition of HP is as it applies to an engine, but with the definition of torque, it might help to show you how the two are different.

Here's an example of how the two can be different. You can add lower gears (numerically higher) to your car, and you will increase the torque while doing nothing to increase HP ('cause you haven't added anything that lets the ENGINE make more power -- rather, you've just allowed the car to use the car's same power more effectively).

And when it comes to the headers, there may be a slight decrease in low-end torque, but HANG ON for the HP gains in the mid-to-high range!

Another example do demonstrate the difference between torque and HP -- put in a spitball in a straw, take a big breath, and blow the spitball out. You can really launch it! Now, put the same size spitball in a papertowel tube, take the same size breath, and see how hard you blow the spitball out of there. (Not too far, I bet.) Now, try running a lap around a track while only being able to breath through that straw, and try running around a track with a 1" or larger tube in your mouth. You'll do a lot better with the larger tube. The same "principles" can apply when changing header sizes, exhaust, intakes, etc.

Ok, enough of my rambling! I'm hoping I can get my car dyno'd so everyone can know what kind of power/torque I'm making!

-Kirk

 

[NDOMTUS]

I'm no engineer... But, from what I know, torque is the ability to turn the axle, and HP is... Well, different. :lol: Sorry, I don't know what the definition of HP is as it applies to an engine, but with the definition of torque, it might help to show you how the two are different.

Here's an example of how the two can be different. You can add lower gears (numerically higher) to your car, and you will increase the torque while doing nothing to increase HP ('cause you haven't added anything that lets the ENGINE make more power -- rather, you've just allowed the car to use the car's same power more effectively).

And when it comes to the headers, there may be a slight decrease in low-end torque, but HANG ON for the HP gains in the mid-to-high range!

Another example do demonstrate the difference between torque and HP -- put in a spitball in a straw, take a big breath, and blow the spitball out. You can really launch it! Now, put the same size spitball in a papertowel tube, take the same size breath, and see how hard you blow the spitball out of there. (Not too far, I bet.) Now, try running a lap around a track while only being able to breath through that straw, and try running around a track with a 1" or larger tube in your mouth. You'll do a lot better with the larger tube. The same "principles" can apply when changing header sizes, exhaust, intakes, etc.

Ok, enough of my rambling! I'm hoping I can get my car dyno'd so everyone can know what kind of power/torque I'm making!

-Kirk

I really appreciate your advice and explanation with the blackwing. I spoke with the guy who did my header installs and he showed me a stock airbox he had pulled out. RESTRICTION!! He said the other C5 boxes (probably older models) were even more. The TPIS kick ass by the way, cant wait for the blackwing....

 

[dsinned]

NDOMTUS, pls let me know when and where you plan to dyno your car. I'll be getting mine in about a month or so from now and would like to make it a duo. I hear there's a place somewhere in Fremont and another in Sacramento. I'd like to test in the Winter mos. when the OAT is coolest so both cars have the "best case" intake air scenario.

I'll may have an aftermarket intake to try soon enough but my intention is to leave it bone stock for initial dyno session and establish a baseline. Still, it would be interesting to compare 01 vs. 02, modified vs. stock, respectively. Maybe we can get a few others to join in and have a Bay Area Z06 owners dyno shootout day. That would be VERY interesting.

 

[streetracer]

NDOMTUS,
Did you ever consider the HALLTECH before the Blackwing? I have it on my car, and very content with it. Although it is pricey, and cutting the radiator shroud is necessary, it is worth it IMHO. I have yet to hear anything bad about it. After having it installed, I immediately noticed a BIG difference. With the HALLTECH, TPIS headers, and ASP underdrive pulley, I dynoed 363.1RWHP/358.1RWTQ. :cheers:

 

[NDOMTUS]

dsinned - I'd actually like to get a few people together to get the old group discount on dyno'in in the bay area if we can. I'm not too familiar with the dyno places around here so if anyone knows of a good one, please help out. I believe a place was mention around here already. I myself would like to see some differences on the dyno between '01 and '02.

streetracer - Halltech was one of the first things I considered seeing as how many people use em. However, cutting the radiator shroud justs leaves me with a bad taste. I know cold air induction is a great thing, but I dont think I could go through with the surgery. However, you mentioned something that got my attention there. Whats the story with the ASP underdrive pulley? Have you considered adding some kind of power duct to your set up? What might be interestin is a dyno comparison between our two cars as they're pretty similar, with the difference of blackwing to be versus Halltech. By the way, VERY nice numbers. :cheers:

 

[Gordy M]

If you are thinking about cutting your Radiator cover, I would suggest your purchase the replacement cover before you do. They are only $35.00 and once you have it is will reliminate almost any hesitation on you part. I ordered mine a month ago and will perform the surgery as soon as I get a free weekend.

 

[NDOMTUS]

If you are thinking about cutting your Radiator cover, I would suggest your purchase the replacement cover before you do. They are only $35.00 and once you have it is will reliminate almost any hesitation on you part. I ordered mine a month ago and will perform the surgery as soon as I get a free weekend.

That would definitely alleviate my surgery worries. This leads to my next big question, how much of a power different is there between the Halltech and Blackwing? Since the Halltech goes behind the shround, doesn't this defeat the purpose of the Z06 screens forcing air into the engine area? Correct me if I'm wrong though. Got no Halltech on as a reference.