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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Okay, I'm sorry if I'm a little slow. This may be a silly question: if I were to buy a C5R block without anything done to it, would it be the stock 346 c.i.? There is such a thing as a C5R block that has stock displacement, right??

The way I understand it, you take a stock aluminum block (in early stages of its' manufacturing) and you put it through a series of "special processes" to make it a C5R block - is that correct? I know that a thread exists on the subject of it's making. I read it and was just unclear about this part. And, these would be available for purchase in stock displacement form??

I feel a little silly for not knowing. :p

As always... THANKS!

Alex :blush:
 

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2002Z06Yellow said:
No. the C5R block is 427 CI.

Well, sort of. It's a bare block with a 4.125 bore, that's heavily strengthened for indurance racing. 427 is just one configuration possible. The stock ZO6 engine block has a 3.9" bore.
 

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C5R block is a totally different block designed specifically for racing. The LS1 and LS6 blocks were not dependable for long races.

It's 7 liters (427 C.I.) and is made from a very strong type of aluminum and heat treated to level 7. The block is subjected to various processes and then checked and the ones that are not "perfect' are discarded. One process is to pressurize the block with nitrogen at 30,000 psi. About 20% of the blocks don't pass this process and are discarded.

Scoggin Dickey wrote a 4 page treatise on how this block is made....totally amazing. This article just came out and can be found on the net. Retail price is about $9,000.00, but until recently you could pick one up for $6,300-6,500.00 This is just the bare block, also known as a "case."

I just wrote a big check last Friday to have a C5R built for my 2001 Z. Found out yesterday that my engine builder found the last available C5R block in the whole country. More will be coming available in the next 60-90 days. After those are gone there may be no more made, or they may stop production for a year, and then start again. my engine will cost at least $22,000.00 and will produce 700 BHP :thumb:

If your planning on building a C5R engine, you better get a block while they are still available. This may have something to do with GM's current problems.....

:cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the replies.

:thumb:
 

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What else are you doing to your engine to get it to 700 HP? I've had my C5R 427 for over two years and it still isn't making near that level of power.
 

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Well, it's in the hands of Joseph Jill @ Superior Automotive Engineering in Anaheim. Joe was a famous drag racer in the 60's and 70's in New York. Had a similar operation there from 1960 to 1990, when he moved to California.

First, the engine is blueprinted and totally balanced. All machining is done in house. Balancing is 0-0-0-0. ALL parts are magnafluxed.

Heads are LS6 and ported and flow to the nth degree. Their cam is custom ground by Comp Cams to their specs with special ramping. Engine will idle at about 850 rpm. Compession ratio is well above 11 to 1. Dampner is 25% reduction and they have never had a problem(but you don't want to have hugh amplifiers and speakers in your audio system). Mazier electric water pumps show 22 hp increase on their engine dyno over the stock mechanical pumps AND they work so much better than the stock pumps in cooling the engine. No thermostat, but they use a "restrictor." Also use Evans coolant, which has a boilover point above 300 degrees at very low system pressures. They use special coil packs, plugs, MSD wires,injectors, fuel pump. Special Crane 1.75 shaft rockers(good for 20 HP), sodium filled valves, special comp lifters(hydraulic). Lunati forged crank, rods and pistons. All parts are magnafluxed.....

Kooks 1 7/8" headers(coated) with a 3'" exhaust system all the way back. I'm having GHL bullets with 6" cans custom made 3" in and 3" out. Tuning to the max.....I use Torco in place of 100 race gas for max timing.

FAST intake with TPIS 90mm throttle body. Vararam intake with carbon fiber bridge.

Joe showed me an article coming out in GM High Tech magazine this month on an LS1 he built that dynoed at 602 HP on the engine dyno. GM execs will be out next week to watch what Joe has done with the "Ecotech" engines.....on the dyno.

Joe got 560 on his first C5R and 580 on the next one. Last one he did was over 600 rwhp on the chassis dyno.

I think the most important thing is starting with a "perfect" engine. I had no idea how important this is and how much is involved in perfectly balancing an engine. ALL work is done in house.

Oh, here's something else Joe does. He tells the piston mfgs not to send rings with the pistons. He has found the perfect rings for these engines.

Add all that up and some other stuff I've forgotten or he hasn't told me and you get that kind of power.

I challenged Joe to make me a wild engine and get it into GM High Tech Magazine :jammin:
 

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Sounds a lot like my engine, other than the Meziere pump (mine is still on the shelf in my garage) and the FAST/90mm setup. My engine builder is Cartek, and since completing my project in late 2002, they've built a couple of 600 RWHP 427s using your pieces. When you mentioned 700 HP, I thought you meant at the wheels. 700 on an engine dyno should be very doable.

The next big jump in NA power is likely to involve LS7 heads. I'll let others do the R&D on that setup before I spring for an update.
 

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marco383 said:
Sounds a lot like my engine, other than the Meziere pump (mine is still on the shelf in my garage) and the FAST/90mm setup. My engine builder is Cartek, and since completing my project in late 2002, they've built a couple of 600 RWHP 427s using your pieces. When you mentioned 700 HP, I thought you meant at the wheels. 700 on an engine dyno should be very doable.

The next big jump in NA power is likely to involve LS7 heads. I'll let others do the R&D on that setup before I spring for an update.
Does anyone know if the new LS7 head will bolt up to our engines? They look like the may have way too much port to use on a stock displacement engine but a big bopper setup could such a port. Maybe a little TIG work in the combustion chambers for a smaller bore.

D.J.
 

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It appears that it will require LS7-specific pistons, and will only work with the big bore (4.125") blocks, so not a cheap project. Unless it's worth at least 40 RWHP, I'll probably pass.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
01ZEE06 said:
Am I correct in assuming the C5R race cars use highly modded LS6 heads, or are there special C5R heads available?
They use C5R heads.
 

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Mike,

At what lift is 380 in the picture?

Can you post the flow numbers tech sheet or direct us mere mortals too it?

Thanks!
 
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