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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Father Larry's original statement
Believe me there isn't that much difference between the Hartdtops performance and the Z06 performance, except for some body cosmetics, suspension, and gearing in the transmission. GM created an illusion to boost sales of the FRC to make up for all their expense in gearing and tooling on the hardtop. If you say a second or two is a big difference, its not really worth cheering about for an extra $20,000. It's all marketing. When they come out with a big block, or come out with a three second machine, then you can say that is a difference to pay $20,000 more for. They have a market of some unknowledgable people buying just because of the name Corvette, and they are taking advantage of it.






sigung86 said:


Sorry... I'm a little late to this conversation.

Larry, no offense intended. I know you love the FRC, and I do too. I think, however, that you are being insulting to all the Z06 owners. :-? And I guess I don't understand why.

Judging from what I've read, and seeing the follow up note elsewhere by FRC Tom, I suspect that the Z06 was on it's way, no matter. I don't know why they waited two years to bring it out. But as great a performer as our FRCs are, they are not up to the Z06. I will run one from 70 to 125 mph, but that might even be a little on the optimistic side.

I don't have a problem with making a case for the FRC being different than the other 99-00 Vettes. But, it will be an aging automobile next year. I fully intend to own my FRC for about 4 years, but when it comes time to upgrade, I will be going to a Z06. The reason is that they aren't making FRCs anymore. I stated in a previous post that I would really like an FRC with a little less power, perhaps, and a little less external dressing than a Z06. However realizing that it ain't gonna happen, I assume the role of pragmatist. My next car will be a Z06.

You never can tell though ... All things being equal, the FRC will probably sit in my garage and be driven on weekends and like that. I believe that at some point, with only 6000 in existence, it will become a collectible.

Take care,
As far as the FRC and Z06 being different, it is a fact that they aren't that far apart. I have done some research on it, and have also torn apart a Z06 with a collegue of mine and compared differences. Why should this insult anyone? As far as the $20,000 difference, it seems that these two moderators just like to attack without trying to comprehend what someone is saying. If they don't understand what I am trying to say, then they shouldn't laugh about, but just ask me to clarify, and if they feel I am being insulting, then they should just bring it to my attention the way you did, without being immature about it. Sick of all these egos! I worked hard to try to get others to this site, when it was not too active. I have talked well about this site, but, geesh, I can't even express an opinion, which is based on fact. This forum is not for Z06's, but for FRC's.

If you want to trade in your '99 for a 2002 Z06, the numbers are approx $20,000 more for the Z06. I spoke to a dealer sellling a 2001, on this website, and he wanted $17,000 more.

This site needs to be narrated by moderators that have a mature head on their shoulders. And, be able to moderate (which means not being sarcastic and laughing at someone's opinion), but using their heads and thinking a little about what someone is saying. It's called three dimensional thinking. Do they really think I would come here to insult Z06 owners? I love the Z06 myself and ALL Corvettes.

In order to have a successful forum, we all need to feel free to express ourselves, without fear of ridicule.

As far as all the work my wife and I have put into trying to make the numbers grow on the registry, we are starting to have second thoughts, because of a few that may make it difficult. Just like when I posted an excerpt form the NCM. I didn't feel it necessary to bore everyone with the whole page of verbage. So what did the moderators do? They posted the whole article, like children, laughing and making fun of it. And, then defended each other, like children. I don't think reactions like this encourage more posts. One will have to think many times before posting an excerpt from another site, or expressing an opinion that may be a little controversial, for fear of ridicule, instead of a legitimate conversation, which will help stimulate this board.

I have gotten some emails from some of the people that I brought to this site, and they commented on ridiculing attitude the two moderators have. No need to mention their names, because they know who they are. If they keep it up, they will start to lose credibility.

Thank you for your intelligent feedback. I do appreciate discussing things with someone that is level headed.


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Posted by FRCTOM....our moderator? In response to one of my other posts

FRC a Collectible????????
As far as the FRC becoming a collectible, I won't live long enough to see it happen.
The ZR1 was a $68,000 car. How long before anyone will see them even reach that price tag, 2010-2020?
I keep hearing camparisons to some of the true collectibles such as the '63 RPO Z06.
They made over 21,500 cars in '63 of only 199 got the Z06 option.
That is under 1% of production, a far cry from the 12% of '99 FRCs.
1967>16 L89s, 20 L88s (2 with the 36 gallon gas tank).
1968>624 L89s, 80 L88s (over 28,500 units made, now we are getting closer to '99 production of 33,270 units.)
1969> 390 L89s, 116 L88s (over 38,700 units, now we have surpased the production of the '99s).
1971> 188 LS6s
I can go on but you get the idea.
One way the FRC will become a collectible at least in my lifetime is for Fatherlarry to take his hammer and anvil and crush about 2 thirds of them.


Collectibles? What do you know about collectibles? Why are you so bent on diminishing the love of the FRC. Seems to me that you are being insulting to FRC owners.....Father Larry
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FRCToms response to my excerpt from the NCM, which was just the first paragraph


you forgot the rest of it
Bowling Green, KY, July 20, 1999 -The National Corvette Delivery Program had an outstanding 1999 season, with 354 of the 1999 model Corvettes being delivered from August 14, 1998 through July 15, 1999. Of the 354 deliveries, 188 were coupes, 147 were convertibles, and 19 were hardtops. The NCM Delivery Team delivered Corvettes in eight colors: torch red (83), light pewter (67), magnetic red (62), black (41), silver (37), white (37), navy (19), and nassau blue (18).

Since the inception of the program in 1995, 737 Corvettes have been delivered at the Museum. Even with numbers posted in 1999, 2000 looks as though it will surpass those figures, since the program already has 67 deliveries in line beginning August 2. Obviously, more and more Corvette owners are selecting the R8C option so they can experience this unique program. The Delivery Program's top Chevrolet dealers for 1999, based upon deliveries to the National Corvette Museum for participants, were:

Top Chevrolet Dealers for the Corvette Museum Delivery Program
1. Bruce Glueck Chevrolet, Jasper, FL
2. Bud's Chevrolet, St. Mary's, OH
3. Robbins Chevrolet, Humble, TX
4. (tie) Kerbeck Chevrolet, Atlantic City, NJ
Steve Moore Chevrolet, Greenacres, FL



The National Corvette Museum is a non-profit foundation dedicated to educating the public through the preservation of the Corvette's past, present and future heritage. Open daily from 8am to 6pm CST. Located just off I-65 at Exit 28 in Bowling Green, Kentucky. For more complete information regarding the NCM Delivery Program, call (800) 205-4248 or visit the National Corvette Museum's website at www.corvettemuseum.com
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And, some help from IMA....our other moderator


Well now that sounds like a complete and comprehensive report Thank You Tom.....:cheers: :lol:

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And, yet another intelligent response from FRCTom

If your going to copy someones info, you might as well take it all. :lol: :lol: :p :p

-------------------------------------------------------------------


And, there is more, however, I don't have any more time for this! If they want to play childish games...let them. BTW....Singung86's response which is the first quote was presented tastefully and maturely. Maybe these two moderators should take a lesson from him
 

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I'm just playing with you Larry about the anvil and hammer thing. If you are going to copy from other web sites the polite thing to do is give that site the credit.
If it were not for the FRC I would not even own a Vet.
You have no idea the crap I went through and ridicule to get the C5Registry to recognize the FRC as a differrent car 2 years ago.
As far as the collectible part goes that is just my opinion, right or wrong. Enjoy your car as I do mine.
:cheers: :cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
FRC Tom said:
I'm just playing with you Larry about the anvil and hammer thing. If you are going to copy from other web sites the polite thing to do is give that site the credit.
If it were not for the FRC I would not even own a Vet.
You have no idea the crap I went through and ridicule to get the C5Registry to recognize the FRC as a differrent car 2 years ago.
As far as the collectible part goes that is just my opinion, right or wrong. Enjoy your car as I do mine.
:cheers: :cheers:
It should be perfectly clear where I copied this from. Read it again!


NCM Delivery Program Concludes a Fantastic Year

Bowling Green, KY, July 20, 1999 -The National Corvette Delivery Program had an outstanding 1999 season, with 354 of the 1999 model Corvettes being delivered from August 14, 1998 through July 15, 1999. Of the 354 deliveries, 188 were coupes, 147 were convertibles, and 19 were hardtops. The NCM Delivery Team delivered Corvettes in eight colors: torch red (83), light pewter (67), magnetic red (62), black (41), silver (37), white (37), navy (19), and nassau blue (18).


How much clearer could it be? Are you accusing ME of being impolite? Are you trying to TEACH me about politeness? Read your own replies, and then tell me who is impolite!!! And, also downright rude. As far as the anvil and hammer, it was an award given to my dad and I from the President of GM for craftsmanship. Should that be a riducule point? From the amount of email's I have received, commenting on your reaction and rudeness, I would say, YOU need to learn some manners. You're worried about me not posting the whole article? Excuse me for committing myself to the site, and trying to participate with bits and pieces of interesting info. So you ridicule (or play) and that excuses you?"Hmmmmm
 

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I can understand your point Larry. Forums are for discussion not ridicule but I don't think anyone on this forum is acting incomprehendably. And, after all, this is Z06vette.com...the Z will always be king here.

Everyone is gonna have their own opinion and, like I've said before, genuine enthusiasm can be seen by others as an obsession. I don't see it this way. There are a lot worse things to be enthusiastic about than an FRC. I think those that don't agree should just not post if they only plan on being negative towards another member...or use a lot of smileys. :D

On the other side of this debate, to a certain extent, is recognition. It's not right to reference or use someone else's data without some recognition. This was apparent with the post on production numbers.

And how do I see the original FRC Vs. Z06 debate? I think it is worth the extra dosh. All I had to do was drive one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Cemo said:
I can understand your point Larry. Forums are for discussion not ridicule but I don't think anyone on this forum is acting incomprehendably. And, after all, this is Z06vette.com...the Z will always be king here.

Everyone is gonna have their own opinion and, like I've said before, genuine enthusiasm can be seen by others as an obsession. I don't see it this way. There are a lot worse things to be enthusiastic about than an FRC. I think those that don't agree should just not post if they only plan on being negative towards another member...or use a lot of smileys. :D

On the other side of this debate, to a certain extent, is recognition. It's not right to reference or use someone else's data without some recognition. This was apparent with the post on production numbers.

And how do I see the original FRC Vs. Z06 debate? I think it is worth the extra dosh. All I had to do was drive one.

I appreciate the manner in which you responded. And, this is my point. It's not the content of the discussion, whether or not we agree or disagree. It's how we respond to each other, with respect. If I was "politically incorrect" then I could have been told politely, which I feel I wasn't. Instead, I was ridiculed and made to feel foolish, which I feel is even MORE politically incorrect. I don't think that it was appropriate for the MODERATORS to respond in such a manner.
 

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Hey guys, let's calm down!! I don't think anyone was meaning to be insulting!!

I have had 3 FRC's before buying my Z06's. I always knew that the FRC was meant to be the performance platform for the C5. :yeadog:

As far as th $20K goes, I was going by MSRP, I didn't know you meant trade-in difference. You didn't make that clear. :-?

To say we make fun of FRC's is waaaay off base!! That just simply isn't true!! Haven't we invited FRC's to join us at the Z06 Fest?? :cool: We created a FRC Registry per the FRC owners requests. We have asked for input from the FRC owners to improve their forum. This Forum knows that the FRC is a BIG part of the Z06 heritage. :cool:

I don't want to lock this thread, but I am not going to stand for a US vs. THEM type of confrontation if this continues. That's not the purpose of this forum.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
FRC Tom said:
I apoligize for anything that offended you. Reading the following thread had me confused and I took it personally.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/zerothread?id=186405
No problem, however, now I'm confused. What is it about my post which you linked to, did you take personal, and why? When I joined the Corvette Forum, I was posting there, asking for a separate forum for FRC's, which was turned down. Then someon from you forum emailed me about the Z06forum, which I wasn't aware of. When I saw that this forum was being effective for our FRC owners (which is all I'm concerned about), then I thought I would address it again on the Corvette Forum. I think all websites, such as this one, and the one I am putting together, should recognize the FRC as a separate entity. Please, HOW did this personally offend YOU.

Second of all the Corvette Forum, is a very well planned out entity. It gives you lots of options, and the people are very nice, so that's why I continue to post there. I think you might be using my post there as some sort of distraction to excuse your behavior. If I'm wrong, then I am sorry, but it's the way it looks. It seems you have purposely gone out of your way to embarrass me, and for what reason I don't know. But that's OK, if you have realized what you did, we'll let bygones be bygones.

My wife and I are working very hard to start our own FRC website which will include all Corvettes. I am consulting with a lot of people, and I would like to use the websites that are very well organized and respected, to link to , from my site, so we are all a family.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
fcalmes said:
Hey guys, let's calm down!! I don't think anyone was meaning to be insulting!!

I have had 3 FRC's before buying my Z06's. I always knew that the FRC was meant to be the performance platform for the C5. :yeadog:

As far as th $20K goes, I was going by MSRP, I didn't know you meant trade-in difference. You didn't make that clear. :-?

To say we make fun of FRC's is waaaay off base!! That just simply isn't true!! Haven't we invited FRC's to join us at the Z06 Fest?? :cool: We created a FRC Registry per the FRC owners requests. We have asked for input from the FRC owners to improve their forum. This Forum knows that the FRC is a BIG part of the Z06 heritage. :cool:

I don't want to lock this thread, but I am not going to stand for a US vs. THEM type of confrontation if this continues. That's not the purpose of this forum.

Who said anyone made fun of FRC's? I never said that. I was ridiculed for my posts and how I presented them. Also, it's not an US vs THEM confrontation, nor was it ever meant to be. This is an issue on how to respect each others opinions without ridicule! That's all it is! I think your moderators are a little touchy, and are too eager to ridicule. I think you should lock this post, because I feel justified in my convictions that I have done nothing wrong, and have just tried to contribute to this forum, so I will only continue to defend my convictions. As, the administrator, you need to evaluate your moderators behavior, and give credit where credit is due. If you can't see what went wrong here, then there is a bigger problem here than I thought. And, please, emailers, I am overloaded with emails for my defense. Send them to the administrator. I have nothing else to say, nor will I. It's just a waste of time and energy. I think we should all just get along, after all we are here for a common interest and should discuss topics in a mature manner, whether we agree or disagree. We are not going to always agree, but it's not an excuse for ridicule. That is what the real issue is here! How many times does an individual have to say that!
 
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