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Discussion Starter #1
My car is at the shop,I'm debating if I should go with headers or not,I'm currently putting a cold air and a mild cam,there telling me it should make 520hp to the wheels,there telling me to put ARH headers in my car,is it going to make a difference,some people tell me they only got 3 to 5 horsepower,it's alot of money to spend for that gain,so I was wondering maybe you guys have any info for me,thanks again guys
 

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Waste of money and could loose torque.
GM did a good job on the special exhaust manifolds which has no problems handling LS7 mod gains as well as supporting the 680 HP ( tuned) LS9 in ZR1
Agreed. This is pretty well documented for the C6Z. Many guys have also suffered heat issues w/ the headers also on the c6z. No real advantage, not worth the trouble or expense.
 

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Thanks guys you guys just saved me about $2,000,since the cars in the shop getting the cold air intake and the cam is there anything you guys recommend to do to the car while it's in there,i just don't want to pay later for another tune and dyno,any help would be appreciated
 

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I had a chance to accelerate from about 70 next to a friend's Z06 that had headers and no cats. He got an initial one car length jump, but we stayed that way up to about 130. Cars are both 2007 Z06s and other than the headers they both have the same bolt ons.
 

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Agreed. This is pretty well documented for the C6Z. Many guys have also suffered heat issues w/ the headers also on the c6z. No real advantage, not worth the trouble or expense.
Damn I wish the guys over on the other forum believed this. Several of them argue that the very reputable shop I have been discussing my next move with, say he is completely wrong. He suggests that the midrange loss is not worth the $$$$$ spent.
 

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Well hears the verdict guys Tune And a cold air Intake I dynoed 486 451 torque. Added Lg 1-3/4 headers. Very Noticeable Gain all threw the power band Dynoed 491 471 torque, and it was very hot no 160 thermostat and with cats Hi flows. But for 800 dollars plus 350 more to change plugs and dyno tune cant beat that. Now if you are going to spend 2k on headears and tune don't get do it get a fast intake and cam. GM like they stated did do a good job on our exhaust system. Get GMs big cam,:drunken: Get fast 102 with the NW tb. you should get to 500 to wheels...but torque wont be as high....
 

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I think you should call a few shops. I believe that headers are worth it. I would call LG Motorsports, Katech and Lingenfelter. Ask them what they think.
 

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I think you should call a few shops. I believe that headers are worth it. I would call LG Motorsports, Katech and Lingenfelter. Ask them what they think.
Yea, I'm sure that these vendors who sell headers are gonna say they aren't worth the money :crazy: :roll:


Guys, you are welcome to spend your money anyway you choose. Nothing anyone can say will convince me differently.
I have personally witnessed base line dyno's followed by header install (3 different brands), followed by tunes and dynos.

Not one showed an appreciable gain in mid range or top end numbers on a C6Z (totally different story with a C5Z).

After looking at the oem exhaust manifold on the C6Z I finally understood why.

I personally love headers and have had them on many cars but they are wasted money (IMO) on a C6Z.

btw, the LG headers actually lost a little power on the dyno

Mike
 

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So headers on a C5Z actually make power but on a C6Z nominal gain. What gains do most C5Z's normally see with the install of headers.
On a C5Z a good set of LT's should net you at least 20rwhp/tq untuned and probably 30+ with a good tune after the install. Some have gained more, some a bit less. When my C5Z was stock, Dynatech LT's, a Vararam CAI and tuning got me close to a 40 rwhp gain.
Agree with Mike about the C6Z headers,,,waste of money unless you are doing Heads/cam or blower install, then they might be worth the money.

Jimbo
 

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I am sure that shops like LG Motorsports, Katech, Lingenfelter, Mallett - A few of the actual shops that do the research in terms of what works on these cars and in developing products for customers... what do they know? They only race in the top levels and two actually work hand in hand with GM...

My friend just had his 2007 Z06 at Blackdog Racing - A full race shop that has two cars in the World Challenge Series. He had a set of American Racing Headers put on his car with a Halltech Killer Bee Intake. Blackdog has a engine dyno, just like Katech, which measures actual engine output. Prior to putting on the headers, his car put out 410 with the Killer Bee. After the headers, he put out 442. So, he picked up 32 with the headers and retune. To some, that might not be worth the gain. To others, it might be. Point is, it is not 5 - 10 RWHP.

I think the guy from ARH once commented on a Header thread in this forum, indicating/challening those whose car has stock headers with a tune vs a car with ARH Headers and a tune - Equal drivers to race side by side and see what happens. Then tell me if there is no power gain.

As Mike said - To each their own. But there are plenty of R&D places that I mentioned above that do the research and are the best shops in the country. If headers were a waste of money, I believe that they would steer us in a different direction as they want their company's integrity to hold and us to to come back for repeat purchases of items (go fast parts, aero dynamic parts. They have hundreds of back to back tests, so I would also call them as I mentioned. I just find it hard to believe that the shops I mentioned above are out to lie to people, given that they have tons of customers on this forum and others.

I know Mike does not like LG Motorsports. My car dynoed at over 500 RWHP with a Vararam intake, LG Motorsports Super Pro Headers, 160 thermostat on a Dynojet. At Blackdog, I put down low 470. I do not think my car would have made more power with just the vararam and 160 degree Thermostat.

Thus, that is what I saw on my car and what my friend just emailed me from his install at Blackdog last week.

I like stock when stock works as well as aftermarket. In this case, I can not say that is true given what I have personally experienced, my friends have experienced.

As I mentioned, to each their own.



Yea, I'm sure that these vendors who sell headers are gonna say they aren't worth the money :crazy: :roll:


Guys, you are welcome to spend your money anyway you choose. Nothing anyone can say will convince me differently.
I have personally witnessed base line dyno's followed by header install (3 different brands), followed by tunes and dynos.

Not one showed an appreciable gain in mid range or top end numbers on a C6Z (totally different story with a C5Z).

After looking at the oem exhaust manifold on the C6Z I finally understood why.

I personally love headers and have had them on many cars but they are wasted money (IMO) on a C6Z.

btw, the LG headers actually lost a little power on the dyno

Mike
 

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The tune got the gains and not the headers.
I like the game shops play, they low ball the stock performance numbers, put headers on, do a full tune and then claim it was the headers when a good tune alone on a stock LS7 can be 50 flywheel HP and still using the stock exhaust.
The Z06 exhaust manifolds were a special design, look inside one.

Vendors you mention are not doing custom design and test but are "canned" and in fact many are selling C5 headers as C6 and worse, C5 headers for Z06s.
Anyone knows that primary size, total length, size of collector require a different header designs as to engine makeup yet one header is being sold from the LS1 to ZR1

Never answered is WHY the same stock exhaust system used on a ZR1 at 160 plus HP more then the Z06 but somehow the same exhaust system is causing a loss of LS7 performance ?

A change of sound, is assumed by some that there was a performance gain but mostly is nothing but pecker stroking at stop lights. :lol:

There is no research as one BS vendor's only research was to look at like ARH design, then have it copied and built outside the USA for a high profit gain.

Dyno's are a joke, they do not comply with the SAE standard and it is the fox guarding the chicken coupe and in most cases the AFTER results are bloated to some cheating which is real easy with that type of measurement tool

I have a friend with a 2009 Z06 with the 2K headers, mine has stock exhaust and in several races I beat him every time in ET and trap speeds and the difference is the tuner I used and who he used.

I am sure that shops like LG Motorsports, Katech, Lingenfelter, Mallett - A few of the actual shops that do the research in terms of what works on these cars and in developing products for customers... what do they know? They only race in the top levels and two actually work hand in hand with GM...

My friend just had his 2007 Z06 at Blackdog Racing - A full race shop that has two cars in the World Challenge Series. He had a set of American Racing Headers put on his car with a Halltech Killer Bee Intake. Blackdog has a engine dyno, just like Katech, which measures actual engine output. Prior to putting on the headers, his car put out 410 with the Killer Bee. After the headers, he put out 442. So, he picked up 32 with the headers and retune. To some, that might not be worth the gain. To others, it might be. Point is, it is not 5 - 10 RWHP.

I think the guy from ARH once commented on a Header thread in this forum, indicating/challening those whose car has stock headers with a tune vs a car with ARH Headers and a tune - Equal drivers to race side by side and see what happens. Then tell me if there is no power gain.

As Mike said - To each their own. But there are plenty of R&D places that I mentioned above that do the research and are the best shops in the country. If headers were a waste of money, I believe that they would steer us in a different direction as they want their company's integrity to hold and us to to come back for repeat purchases of items (go fast parts, aero dynamic parts. They have hundreds of back to back tests, so I would also call them as I mentioned. I just find it hard to believe that the shops I mentioned above are out to lie to people, given that they have tons of customers on this forum and others.

I know Mike does not like LG Motorsports. My car dynoed at over 500 RWHP with a Vararam intake, LG Motorsports Super Pro Headers, 160 thermostat on a Dynojet. At Blackdog, I put down low 470. I do not think my car would have made more power with just the vararam and 160 degree Thermostat.

Thus, that is what I saw on my car and what my friend just emailed me from his install at Blackdog last week.

I like stock when stock works as well as aftermarket. In this case, I can not say that is true given what I have personally experienced, my friends have experienced.

As I mentioned, to each their own.
 

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I remember when the LS7 first came out. A very talented tuner (FRC Tom) could easily get 30+ HP gains with only a conservative, quick tune on a bone-stock Z. More was to be had with additional time/tweaking.
 

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Well guys, given what I have experienced, I would still recommend headers. So, we will agree to disagree.

I still say ask the shops I listed. I would have to believe that these shops also employ guys that can tune very well.
 

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Hey guys. I have seen great gains with headers. I run American racing headers in my 06 z06 with an root type edelbrock E-force supercharger. The headers add noticeable power and a real rumble. It's turns heads at idle. I have the mild to wild control for the exhaust baffles also. Yes they did get the car a bit warm but I wrapped em with header tape and problem solved. I'm running 6 psi boost and Power above 650hp. With the ls7 not being ment for boosted applications it's important have your aluminum block sleeved prior. If not you will crack your block. Callie's rods, diamond pistons and an mast motorsport ls7 heads with 250cc flow are being added currently. The more air you drive through the motor and get out fast the better it breathes. I recommend all of these upgrades, really make an amazing driving experience.
 
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