[droid]

I think as much of a help these forums are they confuse as much. What is the difference between---

1-Just putting on $850 TPIS headers using stock cats and Ti verse----

2- TPIS headers stock cats and Random tech X-pipe

3- Full LG LT's

What are the power diffs in these option? Anyone have any real data not CLAIMS. It seems there are many posts lately with dyno results that don't support the claims of certain headers. Where is the advantage in spending $1500-1900 on the full LG system verse just a set of headers.

DROID

 

[KMeloney]

I think as much of a help these forums are they confuse as much. What is the difference between---

1-Just putting on $850 TPIS headers using stock cats and Ti verse----

2- TPIS headers stock cats and Random tech X-pipe

3- Full LG LT's

What are the power diffs in these option? Anyone have any real data not CLAIMS. It seems there are many posts lately with dyno results that don't support the claims of certain headers. Where is the advantage in spending $1500-1900 on the full LG system verse just a set of headers.

DROID

Droid -- Here's what I know (and that ain't much):

1. If you have an '01 (I'm writing this without recalling what you have), then your PRE-cats will need to be cut off in order to bolt up the TPIS. If you have an '02 or later, then the pre-cats don't exist, and the bolt up is more straight forward. I initially had the TPIS mounted up to my stock cats and Ti, and it sounded great (and felt great, too). As for dyno results, I don't know, 'cause I never got the car on a dyno.

2. H-pipes tend to change the SOUND of the exhaust, but not much else. I now have a Corsa Ti system on my car, and it has it's own H-pipe as part of the design -- but if it didn't come with one, I wouldn't spend the money for one. Also, most people here have reported the stock cats NOT being very restrictive, and suggest that ditching them is not worth the minimal (if any) HP gains, smog, and smell issues. (Oh, and your car will be a LOT louder without cats.)

3. Don't know. When you say "full" LG long-tubes, what do you mean? The TPISs are "full" long tubes... Do the LG's extend beyond the cats? Are you talking about a full header-to-tailpipe exhaust system?

Beyond these things, I'd imagine that many of the long tubes out there result in SIMILAR gains, and that more/different gains can be had based on what you do with the rest of the exhaust system. (FYI, the stock cat-back Ti flows very well -- and it's light.)

Good luck!

-Kirk

 

[IT L GO]

There are only two manufactures that makes true LONG Tube headers (as least that are still production) LG Motorsports and SuperMaxx. All others are mid-tube design or shorties. LG Header is the only header that has the merge tube collector. :cheers:

.

 

[rpallas]

The LG Long Tubes are true long-tube headers at 32" to the collectors; whereas, the TPIS headers are only 21" long. There are a lot of threads on this subject with dyno numbers available. Basically, the LG headers beat the others in torque increases and a little more in hp. Torque is what you feel when you hit the go pedal... :jawdrop: As with most mods, you get what you pay for. The four top World Challenge Corvettes use the LG Pro Series Long Tubes where money is no issue. :yeadog: Why, because they are the best designed header for the LS1 & LS6 engine. And Lou G. is not my cousin. :thumb:

Bob

 

[RobGrnfld]

I would really like to see a true comparison if someone had the time and the money to compare each manufacturer on the same dyno.

I'm still runnin' with the TPIS headers w R/T x pipe and cats and make as much rwhp and in some cases more rwtq with a much smaller cam (224/224/.581 112 lsa).

I'm not saying my headers are better, but I just don't see much difference between the different set ups.

 

[ScDFACHE]

Very good questions and points about the lack of real comparative stats on headers, x-pipes, cats, etc. I have nothing to add in terms of statistics unfortunately. That being said, I have Kooks 1-7/8" headers, X-pipe, cats, and Borla Stinger twin tips at the aft end of a 427 C5R. They sound absolutely awesome - the pure and true sound of AMERICAN RAGE. So my recommendation is buy what you can afford and which sounds the best to you.

In my case, have no idea how much additional lb-ft or rwhp was made in comparison to using 1-3/4" and a stock exhaust system since I was advised to use the 1-3/8 system if I wanted to maximize the performance of the 427. The comparison, of course, is not simply the price and horsepower difference between aftermarket systems and OEM but the incremental difference in cost/bhp or cost/lb-ft gained between the two alternatives. For example, (this is just an example of how I would approach this if I had any real data...)

Kooks/Borla: Cost = $3,500 installed (estimated) rwhp increase = 50 bhp. Cost/hp = $70

LG/Corsa: Cost = $3,000 installed (estimated) rwhp increase = 30 bhp. Cost/hp = $100

Incremental cost = (3,000/30) - (3,500/50) = $30.00

OEM: Cost = $0.00, rwhp gain = 0.00

In this simple example, I would elect to go with the Kooks/Borla but all of the above assumes you have real data and accurate pricing...the pricing is the easy part.
:jammin: :jammin:

ScD FACHE "Viper Eater"

 

[Z06ified]

1-Just putting on $850 TPIS headers using stock cats and Ti verse----

2- TPIS headers stock cats and Random tech X-pipe

3- Full LG LT's

First, TPIS headers are mild steel, not stainless steel. There have been some problems with older higher mileage TPIS headers developing heat cracks. Stainless steel is much stronger and more heat resistant, not to mention you don't have to depend on an external aftermarket coating to prevent rust.

What I'm saying is, I wouldn't bother with headers that are not stainless steel. If you want the TPIS design in stainless steel, the Stainless Works headers are very similar to the TPIS design, but in full stainless steel, and only slightly more expensive (about $900).

High flow cats are worth about 3 to 5 rwhp, and no cats are worth about 5 to 10 rwhp compared to the stock cats.

People swear by the LG headers, and they're good headers for sure, but not worth the money, IMO. They will typically yield about 5 more rwhp than a long tube setup with stock cats. But that difference is not due to the length of the headers, IMO, but the fact that LG's headers use either Random Technology high flow cats or no cats at all. You cannot get LG headers and retain the stock cats.

If you do an apples to apples comparison with TPIS or Stainless Works headers hooked up to the same Random Tech high flow cats with an x-pipe, or with no cats, you'll find little to no power difference compared to the LG's. You may find 2 to 3 more rwhp with the LG's at most. Is 2 to 3 more rwhp worth double the price? That's up to you. Certainly not worth it to me.

 

[droid]

First, TPIS headers are mild steel, not stainless steel. There have been some problems with older higher mileage TPIS headers developing heat cracks. Stainless steel is much stronger and more heat resistant, not to mention you don't have to depend on an external aftermarket coating to prevent rust.

What I'm saying is, I wouldn't bother with headers that are not stainless steel. If you want the TPIS design in stainless steel, the Stainless Works headers are very similar to the TPIS design, but in full stainless steel, and only slightly more expensive (about $900).

High flow cats are worth about 3 to 5 rwhp, and no cats are worth about 5 to 10 rwhp compared to the stock cats.

People swear by the LG headers, and they're good headers for sure, but not worth the money, IMO. They will typically yield about 5 more rwhp than a long tube setup with stock cats. But that difference is not due to the length of the headers, IMO, but the fact that LG's headers use either Random Technology high flow cats or no cats at all. You cannot get LG headers and retain the stock cats.

If you do an apples to apples comparison with TPIS or Stainless Works headers hooked up to the same Random Tech high flow cats with an x-pipe, or with no cats, you'll find little to no power difference compared to the LG's. You may find 2 to 3 more rwhp with the LG's at most. Is 2 to 3 more rwhp worth double the price? That's up to you. Certainly not worth it to me.

Great reply. Where does the x-pipe fit into the equation? It seem it is also a fairly $$$ add-on also.


DROID

 

[roushraven]

x-pipes range in price from less than $200.00 for off-road to $700.00 for the Random Technology's with cats.

 

[droid]

x-pipes range in price from less than $200.00 for off-road to $700.00 for the Random Technology's with cats.

What HP is had from the x-pipe?? Can you run an x-pipe with stock cats? Whats the diff between the offroad and the x-pipe?


DROID

 

[roushraven]

What HP is had from the x-pipe?? Can you run an x-pipe with stock cats? Whats the diff between the offroad and the x-pipe?


DROID

Off-road means without the federally mandated catalytic converters i.e. no cats. Depending on which source you ask, with stock manifolds an x-pipe will add 10-15 hp. 10 with cats and 15 without cats or highflow cats like those from Random Technology.