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Well... I've only had the opportunity to use 91octane gas with ethanol. It sucks. On 93 you should be ok, though your milage will get a bit worse.
 

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mgarfias said:
Well... I've only had the opportunity to use 91octane gas with ethanol. It sucks. On 93 you should be ok, though your milage will get a bit worse.
Thanks, the mileage loss I can deal with; however, I can't deal with any performance compromise such as power loss. I have the 21CMC heads and cam package and I want to exploit it to its fullest. So if using ethanol enhanced gas robs me of power I'll stick with the 92 octane I can readily find at local BP stations.

I read through a string of old threads and couldn't find anything conclusive about the effect of 10% on engine power so I if any of you have experience using it please chime in.

-RR
 

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I don`t know about power loss, but Here in So. cal some Shell stations have the 10% ethanol gas. After 2 tanks in a row of it I had the fuel guage problems, going from half full to empty etc. After changing to Chevron & Valero etc. & adding techron a couple times the problem is gone, Don`t know if ethanol is the culprit or not but that was the only thing different Between the fuels I noticed. Shell is the only station around that says 10% ethanol. :z:
 

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roushraven said:
Thanks, the mileage loss I can deal with; however, I can't deal with any performance compromise such as power loss. I have the 21CMC heads and cam package and I want to exploit it to its fullest. So if using ethanol enhanced gas robs me of power I'll stick with the 92 octane I can readily find at local BP stations.

I read through a string of old threads and couldn't find anything conclusive about the effect of 10% on engine power so I if any of you have experience using it please chime in.

-RR
E10 has about 96.7% heat energy as gasoline which is what gives you 3% less fuel mileage, and will also take about 3% hp from your engine.

As of 1 July 2005 stations nationwide no longer have to display the E10 sticker on the pump so you will have no way of knowing what is in the fuel as an oxygenate...
 

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E10 is common throughout the U.S. especially in the fall and winter months.

E85 is also becoming popular. E85 is 85% ethanol and 15% gasoline. GM is currently the largest manufacturer of E85 compatible vehicles.

Vehicles powered by E85 are called flexible fuel vehicles (FFVs). FFVs can be powered by gasoline, E85 or a combination of the two.
 

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Some tuners have been able to adjust the tune for the E10 gas and actually get better numbers. Jim Hall from Halltech Engineering did mine here in WI where we have E10 gas and it has worked great.
 

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Ethanol based gas has a lower Stoichiometric value and thus the car must be tuned for a particular Ethanol % blend to bring the car back to pure gasoline tuning. You should not switch back and forth or between different Ethanol blends
E5, E10, E15 & E85 once tuned....or you will need to retune for each different blend.

Personally, I recommend buying the highest octane NON-Ethanol based gasoline and adding unleaded Sunoco GT100 or GTPlus which you can buy in bulk drums if necessary
 

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E-85

I Sweden the E-85 blend have been popular in the last year. They sell a lot of cars tuned for that fuel. The benefit is that you get a lot of high oktan. This gives you the oportunity to reduce the timing and with a 350" na engine you can get about 10% hp more. With turbos a lot more. SAAB can get a normal 250 hp 2.3 l turbo engine to produce 310 hp! Well that´s a nice number if you think bigger cubes. Miles/gallon will of course rise.
Regards Tomas
 

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Tomas Danilsons said:
I Sweden the E-85 blend have been popular in the last year. They sell a lot of cars tuned for that fuel. The benefit is that you get a lot of high oktan. This gives you the oportunity to reduce the timing and with a 350" na engine you can get about 10% hp more. With turbos a lot more. SAAB can get a normal 250 hp 2.3 l turbo engine to produce 310 hp! Well that´s a nice number if you think bigger cubes. Miles/gallon will of course rise.
Regards Tomas
I am no expert but I think Ethanol has less energy per volume than gasolene. If you throw ethanol in a car that is not setup for it you will make less power. The benefit is that ethanol is much less likely to detonate....IE, great for forced induction and higher compression ratios. Maybe you can make up for power loss from using ethanol by running a higher compression ratio, more timing, more boost, etc: but you will not make more power by adding it to our current cars.

I have also read that ethanol is more corrosive than gasolene, is this true? Is there any negative effect to our cars if we run ethanol through them?>
 

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Did some more research last night. Ethanol will indeed make less power and get worse gas mileage than straight gasolene in our engines. Ethanol dries out rubber in the fuel system so it has to be mixed with gasolene for its lubricating properties. One other drawback is that water gets into the system very easily, stainless steel or aluminum would be a better option for fuel systems designed to use ethanol.

Turbo setups are ideal for ethanol, the computer can recognise the mixture you are running and adjust boost accordingly (more boost for higher ethanol content like E-85, less boost for lower ethanol content like E-10).
 

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Just from a purely "end user" perspective (b/c I do not have the chemical background to understand the properties of the various options out there), we've had E10 in our gas here in the DFW area for the last 2 months. I've filled up all 4 of my vehicles several times at least and not seen any noticeable differences in performance. I haven't changed the tune, either.

Granted, I don't know if you could "feel" the difference a 2-3% loss might give you. I mean changing weather conditions can result in that easily.

I did notice 1mpg less in my Lightning truck when I filled up today. Went from 13 to 12.
 

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WA 2 FST said:
we've had E10 in our gas here in the DFW area for the last 2 months. I've filled up all 4 of my vehicles several times at least and not seen any noticeable differences in performance. I haven't changed the tune, either.
Like Wes said, I have also have been running on E10 for the past 2 months. At just about the same time the switch to E10 was made I replaced my plugs and got a minor A/F tuneup. Over the past few weeks the engine has become more difficult to start so yesterday I took it in for a look-see and we found all of the plugs to be corroded and whiteish [ is that a word :) : ]. Coincidence? I don't know but we changed plugs again and checked the tune and all looked correct. Our current thinking is that with E10, we may need to switch to a colder plug. We plan to watch it a bit more closely for a few weeks and see if the condition is repeatable.

Any different/better ideas or suggestions?
 

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10% ethanol 92 octane gas is all we generally can find in Minnesota. I've had no issues with it in my '04 and it dynoed 366 rwhp and 361 rwt with just a tune.
 

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Rippied.Z06 said:
10% ethanol 92 octane gas is all we generally can find in Minnesota. I've had no issues with it in my '04 and it dynoed 366 rwhp and 361 rwt with just a tune.

It appears to be happening all over and now that they do not have to post it, you have no way of knowing it. In PA there seems to be some posting occurring but down in Mo all of the stations have removed the posts. Bottom line is there is no way of knowing what you are getting is just gas or gas plus 10%.
 

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Could this be why my urban cycle has dropped from 13.5mpg to 10.5mpg in the last month?

The car is now a bitch to start and idel when hot compared how it was a month ago.
 

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My car has never so much a hicupped from the ethanol blend. I wish I didn't have to run it, but it hasn't been so bad. Last highway trip with cruise set at 75 mph, I got 28 mpg. It can't be costing me much in fuel economy.
 

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Rippied.Z06 said:
My car has never so much a hicupped from the ethanol blend. I wish I didn't have to run it, but it hasn't been so bad. Last highway trip with cruise set at 75 mph, I got 28 mpg. It can't be costing me much in fuel economy.
I noticed almost no change on hiway mpg, but the short urban cycle seems to have taken a beating - and I make a point of short shifting and even oing 1st to 4th and 5th manual skip shifts these days, seldom over 2000rpm, and mostly in 5th and 6th whan I can.
 
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