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Discussion Starter #2
ps. I have no plan on getting such thing , I was just curious as I passed by that as I was doing my research on a throttle body Im thinking about getting before my tune, thanx
 

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Pretty much a waste. Doesen't add any horsepower and you may get throttle body icing. What is does do is help prevent heat soak and that does help prevent you from losing horsepower. I do have the mod on my cars and never had a problem, but I live in South Florida. :cheers:
 

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COUTO1981 said:
whats this for? and is this an alternate of switching to a ported Throttle body?
No inst' not an alternate. Engine coolant circulates through you TB, to prevent icing. :cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter #5
IT L GO said:
No inst' not an alternate. Engine coolant circulates through you TB, to prevent icing. :cheers:
well I keep my car in the garage and warm it up there in the winter, would that cut my changes of that icing issue you talk about in case I decided to get such mod?
 

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COUTO1981 said:
well I keep my car in the garage and warm it up there in the winter, would that cut my changes of that icing issue you talk about in case I decided to get such mod?
It's better to safe than sorry. I used to be a big advocate of this mod. I no longer am. If you do a search you will find a thread that talks about Icing with ambient temperatures as high as 60 degrees. :cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Im setting my self for humiliation :eek:o: , but I'll get over it especially if I learn from this :pp: ...

when you say "I used to be a big advocate of this mod" do you mean you were for it or against it? I just dont know the correct defination for "advocate" :eek::
 

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COUTO1981 said:
Im setting my self for humiliation :eek:o: , but I'll get over it especially if I learn from this :pp: ...

when you say "I used to be a big advocate of this mod" do you mean you were for it or against it? I just dont know the correct defination for "advocate" :eek::
I was for it, I am no longer :z:
 

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IT L GO said:
It's better to safe than sorry. I used to be a big advocate of this mod. I no longer am. If you do a search you will find a thread that talks about Icing with ambient temperatures as high as 60 degrees. :cheers:
This is correct. When certain other atmospheric conditions exist (humidity, temperature, barometric pressure) at just the right levels, icing can occur at almost ANY temperature. If anyone has seen the documentary about the fountains at the Bellagio in Las Vegas, you'll see that they were experiencing icing problems with the water jets at temperatures WELL above 60 degrees. In the TB, the air flow through it can make ice form when other conditions are right. It could be a dangerous mod and no one has shown any advantages to doing it.

Charlie
 

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Discussion Starter #10
NYCHASM said:
This is correct. When certain other atmospheric conditions exist (humidity, temperature, barometric pressure) at just the right levels, icing can occur at almost ANY temperature. If anyone has seen the documentary about the fountains at the Bellagio in Las Vegas, you'll see that they were experiencing icing problems with the water jets at temperatures WELL above 60 degrees. In the TB, the air flow through it can make ice form when other conditions are right. It could be a dangerous mod and no one has shown any advantages to doing it.

Charlie

Dangerous as in what? What happens when the TB ices as you guys say? thanx
 

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COUTO1981 said:
Dangerous as in what? What happens when the TB ices as you guys say? thanx
The throttle blade sticks open :z:
 

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fwiw-i did the mod over 2 yrs. ago.no problems whatsoever.car runs like a scalded dog!however i live in a texas [a little warmer here] :guiness:
 

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I live in balmy Florida and have done this mod to two c5s. I've never had any problems, but I also haven't noticed any gains. IMHO, don't waste your time with it.
 

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COUTO1981 said:
and then what happens?
I guess you're serious, aren't you?

If ice forms in the TB and the blade jams open...it's the same as the throttle sticking in an open position. In simpler terms, the gas pedal will not return to the "up" position "and then what happens" is you probably crash. :yeadog:

Charlie

PS I'm not saying that you guys that had no problems after doing this mod are lucky but, have the gains outweighed the risk? Just so I'm clear on all this...there is a DEFINITE risk that icing can occur in an unheated throttle body, at almost ANY temperature. Just why do you think the thing was engineered that way in the first place. :roll:
 

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Don't do it. Waste of time... it's overrated.

Alex
 

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NYCHASM said:
This is correct. When certain other atmospheric conditions exist (humidity, temperature, barometric pressure) at just the right levels, icing can occur at almost ANY temperature . . . In the TB, the air flow through it can make ice form when other conditions are right.
Charlie
I must be bored waiting for the Spurs/Pistons (my team) game to start.
WAY, WAY more than you asked or wanted to know.
And, my memory may be faulty. I've been retired a long time. :-?

Airplane carburetors are particularly prone to "high-temperature" icing at low-power (idling) settings. Air flow through the venturi "cools" it a lot. As does the fuel pulled in at the same time to evaporate.

"An equation that chemists call the Ideal Gas Law, shown below, relates the volume, temperature, and pressure of a gas, considering the amount of gas present."

PV = nRT,
R is the molar gas constant,
where R=0.082058 L*atm*mol**-1*K**-1.

"Because the gas constant, R, is the same for all gases in any situation, if you solve for R in the Ideal Gas Law and then set two Gas Laws equal to one another, you have the Combined Gas Law":

(P1*V1)/(n1*T1) = (P2*V2)/(n2*T2)

It is left to the "student" to determine what is going on as air moves through the throttle body from "1" to "2" (the gas in this simple case is air, since we have fuel injection "later", and don't have to include heat transfer from fuel evaporation).
Calibrated thermocouples and pressure probes "help".
It is left to the "student" to figure out how to measure velocity. :lol:

That's why "Carb Heat ON" is part of the airplane landing checklist. Except, instead of sticking open, carb ice clogs them, and they lose power. And eventually quit. Forgetting this "gets" a few people "landing a bit short" every year. Not good. :eek:
 

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NYCHASM said:
I guess you're serious, aren't you?

If ice forms in the TB and the blade jams open...it's the same as the throttle sticking in an open position. In simpler terms, the gas pedal will not return to the "up" position "and then what happens" is you probably crash. :yeadog:

Charlie
:-? :-?
SAY WHAT?????? :screwy:
This is a fly by wire system!!
The throttle position sensor and throttle pedal sensor mismatch will send the traction control system into a tizzy and you will go into limp mode!!
DIC will go crazy and you get 1800 rpm with NO throttle control!!
NOT, stuck throttle mayhem!!!

Ken
 

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Kens06 said:
:-? :-?
SAY WHAT?????? :screwy:
This is a fly by wire system!!
The throttle position sensor and throttle pedal sensor mismatch will send the traction control system into a tizzy and you will go into limp mode!!
DIC will go crazy and you get 1800 rpm with NO throttle control!!
NOT, stuck throttle mayhem!!!

Ken
Ken,
If you re-read my post you will see the expression "in simpler terms". I know this is a "fly by wire" system and there is no throttle linkage. Why do you assume that there will be a TPS mismatch? If I floor the gas pedal and the TB opens completely and ice prevents it from closing, where's the mismatch?

Since there are NO gains to this mod, why would anyone do it? The velocity of the air passing through the TB can reduce its' temperature to the point of icing if other conditions are present. And that's what it's all about!

Charlie
 

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It was engineered to help in very cold climate regions to aid in the engines warming quicker. There is very little risk especially in the warmer climates. Most folks in the northern climates garage their vettes for the winters. Agreed that the gains are minimal but the risks are also minimal at best.


NYCHASM said:
I guess you're serious, aren't you?

If ice forms in the TB and the blade jams open...it's the same as the throttle sticking in an open position. In simpler terms, the gas pedal will not return to the "up" position "and then what happens" is you probably crash. :yeadog:

Charlie

PS I'm not saying that you guys that had no problems after doing this mod are lucky but, have the gains outweighed the risk? Just so I'm clear on all this...there is a DEFINITE risk that icing can occur in an unheated throttle body, at almost ANY temperature. Just why do you think the thing was engineered that way in the first place. :roll:
 
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