Corvette Z06 Forum banner

GM Just voided my powertrain warranty

36K views 79 replies 39 participants last post by  DucZ06  
#1 ·
Last Monday my engine seized. GM roadside assistance was great, got the car to the dealership no problem. The dealership then told me that the car needs a new engine and that it would be covered under warranty no problem. However, when the codes from the engine were sent to GM, GM said that it showed a non-factory calibration (tune) and that they were voiding my powertrain warranty. Now I am looking at being about $18k out of pocket to fix the problem!!!???

I am the second owner of the car, it only has 24k miles on it. One of the main reasons that I bought the car was because it only had bolt on mods, intake and exhaust, which I knew wouldn't affect the warranty. I didn't know that the engine had been tuned which would consequently void the warranty- I never would have bought the car knowing that.

I have read the threads of the others that this has happened to. Can anyone give me any advice as how to proceed. I am aware of Magnusson-Moss, but can't we just get along without a lawsuit? It seems that by doing this GM is voiding the warranty on many unsuspecting people. It seems like if they are going to do that, then they should at least run the codes on your car anytime it comes in for service and tell the owner then and there rather than waiting until a catastrophic failure for that to be the first time an unsuspecting owner finds out that there is no warranty.
 
#6 · (Edited)
I had an '08 ZO6 that suffered an engine failure at 7K miles, and the engine was replaced under warranty. The car was totally stock, and the SM at the dealership told me, had their computer scan detected a tune, the engine would not have been covered. The service manager and the ownership of your dealer can be very influential in these decisions. Usually, a well respected dealership can prevail on the customer's behalf over the factory regional rep. Unless you can bring that kind of pursuasion to your case, you're probably just out of luck. If you hear something like, "it's out of our hands", then either your dealer is not in the most highly regarded group, or, he's just unwilling to step in, which is always possible. Hiring a lawyer is your choice, but in this circumstance, I think it would be a waste of money.
 
#7 ·
This may be a long shot, but I would request to see their policies in writing ASAP that states something to the effect that "If a vehicle under warranty is detected to have a tune programmed other than the original factory tune, this voids all power train warranties in full regardless of tune"

If it is not in writing, they can't enforce it, but it may be at the discretion of the dealership.

No policy, no enforcement.

Might even be a good idea to get a lawyer to walk into that dealership and demand a copy of it so when they refuse him, his testimony holds greater weight than your own in a court of law.

Good luck.
 
#10 ·
Sorry to hear about your situation.

I was under the impression that even if the car was modified, the dealer/manufacturer would have to prove that the modification was the direct cause of the damage before refusing to repair the vehicle or void the warenty; I could be wrong.

However, it looks like the path of least resistance would be to build a new motor and not deal w/the dealer or GM
 
#12 ·
The manufacturer can refuse warranty service if the vehicle is, essentially, not as delivered. A judge or jury may decide the decision is unreasonable and order the service. If the manufacturer believes its position questionable, it will usually agree to something before going to court.

In this case, the path of least resistance costs $18K, so it might be worth a little resistance.
 
#17 ·
Thanks for all of the responses guys. I am still trying to plead my case to GM and am hopeful of a positive result. I bought this car not only because it is the best value on four wheels but also because I believe in the company that built it and the warranty that came with the car. I have always been a supporter of our tax dollars going to help the big three and even when people ask me about GM folding under bankruptcy and whether I was worried about my future warranty work if that happened, I would always tell them that I am not worried that I know that even in hard times GM would stand by their product. I am still hopeful that my faith was well placed. I will keep you all posted.
 
#19 · (Edited)
Did you buy the car from a private seller, or off a GM dealership? If from a GM dealership, you definitely win. I'm not one for spurious lawsuits, but if you bought from a private seller, you could possibly take him/her to court to recover the costs, since their warranty-voiding modifications were not disclosed at the time of sale you'd probably win here, too.

Also maybe worth considering... the GM warranty provision quoted above says "...for those components that are damaged or otherwise affected by the installation...". Your motor seized, depending on what the PCM changes were, the changes might not have anything to do with it. You should ask GM to document the non-factory changes they discovered in the PCM, and also provide documentation to show that those changes induced your engine failure (you could tell them it's because your considering suing the seller). I would think it would be incumbent on them as the unquestionable subject-matter experts to show the changes caused the problem and not incumbent on you to show they didn't.

I think you'd be hard pressed to make PCM changes that would cause a motor to seize. Motor seizure is usually a function of bad oil pressure and flow rate or overspeed, you can't really cause this kind of failure with a leaner mix or high advance (which is likely to be the nature of the changes in your PCM - these changes are more likely to burn valves or pistons).

Lastly, I think the PCM records the last 5 seconds of engine operation prior to a failure (or if not that, then it does a "freeze frame" capture of all the engine data when the fault occurs). You should ask GM if it does, and for this data, too. I would bet it records oil pressure and oil/coolant temperatures and stuff like that. This might show that oil pressure dropped just prior to failure, which would have nothing to do with the PCM tune.
 
#20 ·
Sorry to hear the bad news. GMpartsdirect web site has the complete LS7
Engine Assy. P/N 17802397 for about $13,500.00. Look around the web I've seen LS7's for sale with a warranty just pocketed the info in my head so the LS7's are out there. Also contact some known builders they can lead to you
to some good motors probably near you. Good luck.
 
#51 ·
HOld on a minute. If that engine was modified by a private party, how can anybody expect GM to be responsible for warranty, especially if the warranty documents clearly EXCEPT tuning modifications by parties other than GM? That is simply unreasonable. If the facts are as the original poster wrote, then this is not a GM problem.

GM designed, built and satisfied all the Federal mandates required to sell a car. If another party then modifies the car, that does not create legal liability for the current owner (e.g., EPA, etc.), so no EPA fines; and second, GM is not responsible for warranty of unauthorized mods.

Why blame GM? Would you really blame GM because somebody else modified the car outside the specs under which it was built? Maybe that's one of the reason THEY WENT BANKRUPT in the first place.
 
#24 ·
Hire a lawyer and then go about proving the failure was in no way related to the tune. Of course if the person who tuned your car raised the rev limiter or made some other changes that could put extra stress on the valvetrain then I can see where this could go badly for you...

Although the magnuson-moss warranty act is here to protect us the dealerships usually force the owner to prove the modification was not directly related to the failure. This ends up being expensive and time consuming in cases such as this so most people don't even bother trying to fight it.

If you've got the time and tenacity you can try fighting this, but if you want to be back behind the wheel in the minimum amount of time you might as well just turn the motor over to a competent shop and have it rebuilt.

U.M.
 
#26 ·
Just an update to you all. I talked to some really great folks at GM, particularly at the plant in Bowling Green, but unfortunately there is nothing they can/will do. I had to at least try and fight before rolling over. Thanks for all of your support.

I talked to Tim over at Lingenfelter last week and I plan on shipping the car out later this week or next. At the end of the day I can't be too unhappy with the prospect of a 630hp upgrade.
 
#29 ·
Ha, don't make me laugh
To even get into that position you'd have to spend thousands of dollars on a lawyer who could be a moron and lose the case even if you were in the right and GM lawyers on retainer would eat your clock in months of even getting a decision.

All you have to do is file a claim in your state against GM wait months and then find out you sued the wrong party, ie the dealer, or you sue them and find months later it was to be GM but suit has to be in Warren Mi and months later after paying tons you find you lost because your lawyer is not licensed in that state.

All GM has to say is if spending 10 of thousands of dollars on a used car why did you not have car checked first to see if car had been tampered with.

Mute point, winning against GM as to the MMA is like asking your mother in law to STFU :lol:

Worse though is the mods were also against EPA federal law and GM could ask them to contact you to pay the $10,000 fine for violation of smog laws. :moon:
 
#28 ·
Like I said, if GM says the failure is due to the modifications, they're within their Rights to refuse to provide coverage for the damage. But the original seller is the one who made the modifications. He sold it to you, in part, with the assertion that the car was still covered under warranty. If he did not disclose the fact that he'd made changes that potentially voided the warranty, he is very likely liable for either the cost of repair or a refund on the sale of the car. If you do note attempt to take action against the seller for some or all of the costs, you are cheating yourself out of what is (most likely) rightfully yours!
 
#31 ·
My condolences, but your gripe should not be with GM but with the seller. He modded the car. With all due respect to the modders and tuners, GM shouldn't be liable when drawing extra HP from an engine results or contributes to an engine failure. While we do not know for sure what caused this failure, drawing more HP, raising the rev limits, and other common hop-up tricks cannot help the car's durability.

While you'd need a really strong law in your state to prevail in a lawsuit with a private seller, as usually private sellers have no obligation to disclose these kinds of things (if he was smart, he wrote AS IS on the title conveyance), but if he represented in writing that the car was still under factory warranty, and/or if he did not put AS IS in the conveyance, you may have a chance.

You could at least ask an attorney to send the seller a demand letter asking for the cost of the repairs you seek.

Good luck.
 
#34 ·
Having sold many used cars/private sale, all in good or better condition, I always put AS IS on the bill of sale. Once my old car rolls out the driveway, I have zero control over how the buyer drives/treats the car. He could cruise straight to the drag strip & drive the snot out of it & call me up to complain about whatever.

Works both ways.

Not to say the OP did anything wrong.
 
#36 ·
This is a case of he said, I said and no one will win at the end. I seriously doubt that a simple tune can blow a motor without other work done to it. The motor can take allot more that a simple 50 Hp gain (if you can even get that much) on a tune with stock air box and exhaust. I still think there are other factors that played into this.
 
#37 ·
pretty much the same thing happend to me. I poped a one year old LS2 motor with a tune, cam, headers, cold air intake, other stuff. no warranty.

I hope Lig treats you right. Ill have about 900hp next week.

Suggestion go to a bunch of shops and get a lot of options you can do and an upgrade path as well
Try Dallas Performance